What are the best lipos?
 

I've been working on a spreadsheet for awhile comparing capacities of different lipos to see if they use the same cells. Only progress I made was that the Enerland 25c XP cells were used in Flightpower evo25 packs and Hyperion Litestorm packs. Also, the enerland 30c XQ cells are used in Flightpower evo30 packs and Hyperion LVZ packs.

Another possible, more up to date connection would be Hyperion G3 CX 25c packs and flightpower EON-Lite 25c packs. The 1300,1600, 2100, and 2500 capacities are the same. The Hyperion G3 VX pack is 35c and the Flightpower EON-X 30c packs have different C ratings, and Capacities reflect that. The two companies could be using the same cell manufactuer.

I looked into Neu and I was surprised. They have a 40/70c SP series along with a 35/60, 30/60, and 25/50 series. They don't match up with any other cells, and I'm thinking Neu makes their own cells, but I can't back that up.

I'll post the spreadsheet when I finish it. I only have Neu, Flightpower, and hyperion on there now. I still need to add enerland cells. I might get it done tonight...:sleep:

I might add other companies too, just ask. Thinking about thunder power... I have maxamps on there too... They suck and all their numbers are odd-balls. They truely suck. They don't advertize C ratings prominately because they prey on noobs who don't know to look for c ratings...:whip:

So this might be worthless info to some people, but it might help other people out. I'm looking forward to seeing info from BrianGs battery testing station if that gets up and running. The point of this thread is to decide which battery company is the best and try to connect companies with the same cells. In other words, I'm bored.

http://www.neumotors.com/store/page4...8_detail_1.png

http://www.allerc.com/images/Picture...35-4200-XX.jpg

DUDE!!! You've got to add RCM packs to the spreadsheet!

Here's what I put together. It's a "first draft". Tell me if anything is wrong.... I might be able to get this as a google docs thing or somethin.... :whistle:

Fourth try's the charm.:sleep:

http://i345.photobucket.com/albums/p...comppic2-2.jpg

man you've got a lot of spare time on your hands...

Yeah, 2 hours goes a long way. Or was it 3 hours? :neutral:

I'm pretty dissapointed because I don't think Hyperion and Flightpower use the same cell manufacturer. I don't see any other connections either... :diablo:

We just need someone who's taken apart packs to chime in and tell us what they've seen. Where the cells were made... :whistle:

Maybe I'll combine some discharge graphs too if I can find a way. :whistle:

:gasp: omg I forgot zippies! I'll do those tomorrow... :sleep:

IMO, I think Neu, FP, and Hyperion all use the same cell manufacturer. FP I think underrates their packs BIGTIME and/or use better cells from the factory/batch. Neu looks like they have the same prices as FP...and Hyperion is drastically cheaper (that's why I went with them) because IMO, they work with larger quantities? Largest of the three companies.

Or maybe Hyperion gets the lower grade cells, doubt it though, but if that were true, then we can only expect more insane levels of performance over the G3's, which I don't even know if it's possible. :yipi::neutral:

Anyways, about the graph, I am pretty sure the 4200 G3's and the 3800 X30's are the same cell, the 3300 G3's and the 3350 X30's, the 2600 G3's and the 2450 X30's, etc... you have to go by weight, because they are merely rating the capacities and C ratings differently.

FP states 3.7v/cell @ 15C discharge.... my G3's are getting (if my Eagletree is to be believed) a little over 3.7v/cell at 6.5C....?

I am strongly considering buying a pair of X30's 3800mah packs soon, see how they compare to the G3's... I am guessing the X30's will be more at least the same, if not, more powerful, despite being rated lower across the board.

Me tired too, going to bed...

Ok, here is what I know...

As far as 25c cells go, fp, tp, polyrc, polyquest and hyperion all use enerland cells. Not anymore, as enerland does not sell to any of the mentioned as of a few months ago, but for all of the packs floating around it applies.

Now on to 30c stuff. The fp evo 30 is enerland, as are most of the rest of the 30c cells that have been sold for the past few years from tp, polyrc, polyquest, and hyperion. Pretty sure all of them, but definitely fp and polyquest are using the same 30c cells.

The fp eon line is different, non enerland stuff from what I have heard, but I have not touched those packs yet. Some people have had issues, and the line has been revamped at least once to my knowledge.

Hyperion G3 packs are the newest game in chinese lipos, not sure but I think that hyperion are the only ones who are using this cell ATM. Good stuff, and priced very well. These are getting very popular.

Tp have a 40c cell that is badass... Probably the best out there from what info I have seen. Not sure if anyone else is using that cell either. Pricey though, most likely sell very well to the plane guys and to people looking for max performance. Eating into fp business, but that is the nature of the game.

FP are supposedly having issues. The owe enerland money (rumored) and cannot work a deal with hyperion to get the G3 cells (also rumored). Plus they gave great planes (tower hobbies) exclusive reselling rights to the US, so alot of people who used to sell FP no long can (unless they go thru GP, and most appear to dislike that).

Maxamps have nice labels, and are waterproof. They also have a great advertising program, and lots of exposure. From what I have been told, by people with no experience, maxamps makes the best lipo ever, and, I quote "Me rustlar id toe sweet maxamps rulez n u r a douche". Not sure what that means but I am sure someone can translate...

I am not sure what has happened to polyrc, I have not looked into them for a while.

I will add more info as I get it...

Means he's a tool bag and he just classified you as a douche.:lol:

James- any info on neu packs?

Got the chinese lipos done. I'm mixing them into the main one and I have so many now I'll probably separate them by c rating.

http://i345.photobucket.com/albums/p...ineselipos.jpg

Here is a newer chart with everything

http://i345.photobucket.com/albums/p...final1lipo.jpg

Linc, are you sure that FP and Hyp. are not that same cells? They both seem to advertise the same specs, 5C charge, 4x cycle life...

Even like I said in my last post, a few of the packs in the lineup seem to match up perfectly as far as weights go, and the difference in mah, could just be FP rating their packs conservatively?

Or maybe all the brands really are sourcing from different manufacturers, and they all just payed royalties to a patent owner for the same cell chemistry/manufacturing process?

BTW, I think Hyperion might be coming out with a 40 - 45C pack soon, as they still have their "VZ" line to fill in with G3 packs.

Also, TP 40C packs seem to be the same cells as G3's, only slightly more powerful... same discharge curve and everything, just slightly higher voltage under load. (proportional to 40C vs. 35C)


Only time will tell I guess.

Shouldn't prices be added to the chart? :smile:

I emailed flightpower asking about their packs and cells comparing to hyperion. I'll tell you if I hear back.

I don't think hyperion and flightpower have the same cells because: Flightpower EVO-X LITE advertizes 25/40c while Hyperion advertizes 25/45c. It could be a conservative rating, but I think on the cell is says the capacity and c rating so the company can't really change it. There is a possiblity and it would be really cool if they were the same, but I don't see it.

And prices, do you mean with every pack? :neutral: :lol:

I see names, I see capacities, I see C rating, but I don't see cell counts... And I'm not quite sure what this is going to be used for....

I could see if being useful to list every pack and all its specs and then you can use Excel's sort feature to find the right pack for you, or see whats available and compare.

EDIT: But that would require user's to exert an effort and think, or actually know how to use Excel and the sort feature....

i have owned Losi, TP, Enerland, PolyQuest, and NeuEnergy packs. I personally like the Neuenergy packs the best. i have the 30c packs now and i was thinking of getting their new 35c packs in the next couple of weeks. TP packs have always been great but i wish they would use 10ga wire on their packs instead of the old school 12ga. I had some enerlanc packs that had 8ga wire and were awesome but i still think the Neus were slightly better. i had a one of the new hyperion g3 packs but never used it. i sold it before i ever tried it but i know the Tekno guys LOVE them. the TP 40c pack only comes in 2s or 4s to my knowledge but if they make a 5s softpack in 40c let me know. that would be sick.

my understanding is that TP and NeuEnergy both have always used enerland cells. are they using something else now? TP has their new 30c propower line that i like. are they enerland? and is the 35c Neu enerland or not?

Look at the mah ratings, they don't match. It seems the new Neu packs aren't enerland, and I don't think the old ones were either... You should get the Neu 40c packs!

I love my polyQuest Packs... they seem to take a nice beating, even up to 60 Degrees celcius... they keep on ticking.. one puffed up, and a returned back to normal... PolyQuest all the way...

No one uses Enerland anymore, except PolyQuest as far as I know.

A123Systems bought out Enerland, and Polyquest as well, as it is now a division of A123systems.

I am not sure if they have a 'newer' chemistry to compete with the other brands packs (G3 35C, TP 40C....), because the old school Enerland cells don't even compare to these packs, as good as they are.

About Chinese manufacturing... for a given price point, you CAN make a MUCH better product in China vs. Korea, or anywhere else. Take for example my oldest brother's brand new audiophile vacuum tube amplifier ('Melody' brand), this amp has been rated, with 'price-no-object', THE best amp in the world for mid range acoustics, period. The amp costs around $2,500... the quality is out of this world, the sounds it makes I can't even describe... now if you tried to make the very same amp, same quality control elsewhere, it will cost much more. My point here is well, I don't know what my point is... all I am saying is that you can make a much better product in China than anywhere else, as long as it's not a slave labor, boot camp type operation... simply because it is much cheaper to do things over there.

Im hungry, I'm going to get something to eat.

You can't forget these cells http://www.impaktrc.com/images/FB4400XT-6S.jpg
They are the absolute best cells I have ever ran. It feels like there is another cell in the pack, definitely more powerful then the Hyperions.

You've ran the new hyperions and these? I remember, I think takedown, mentioned these awhile ago. Iever really looked into them though... I'll see what the hype is then I might add them or at least check if any numbers match up.

My next batch of lipos will be the G3s..... Can't wait to try these babies out..

NEU NEU NEU!! These are the best packs I've used. I have owned maxamps, and FP. Neu packs are the only ones that I've used that seem to have every bit of burst all the way down to the end of the run. I love my Neu lipos!

I've run them both, these FullyMax cells are beasts. The Hyperions are great, and for the price hard to beat. But for straight performance, nothing I've run is this good.

Do you have any other packs you can compare with?

Sounds like you just wanted to brag about yours brothers AMP, which by the way is a total waste of money. I used to be into audiophile type amps, and let me tell you. you can't tell the difference from one amp to the next. We even tested that high end equipment in the electronics lab at my university and the cheaper shite came out on top. LOL.. Take the $2500 and buy a kick ass RC or donate it to some homeless kids

Well you need a certain amount of brain cells to tell the difference, I am not sure, but I don't think that many. :neutral:

I am not talking about your average supposedly 'hi-fi' amplifier here. Don't even bother arguing about it.

Canadians.........

I believe the Flightpowers are spec'd EVO25 and EVO30 and the new ones are EON28 and EON33.

I have a pair of 3S 3700mah EVO25's and a pair of 2S and a pair of 3S of 4500mah EVO30's and they are all excellent packs. Tons of power right until the end. Breaks all 4 wheels of my G2R loose even going a solid 20mph...

The only other packs I used were some Maxamps 8K's and those did not compare at all...

+1 on these packs. Just recently purchased a pair of 2600mah 6S I run parallel for 5200mah, and can just say wow. Hardly get warm. They out perform my 3S 4900mah 25c Trackpower's, and I think Flightpower's are under rated. Fullymax recommend only 2C charging, which is fine with me.

BP-REVO, FP has discontinued the 28, and 33; they are now replaced by the EON X-Lite(25C), EON X30(30C), and if rumor is to be believed, an EON F3A line (which might be around 35 - 40C?)

FP does always underrate their packs, but to be honest, it's probably more accurate in the real world.


The Fullymax packs, what are the prices on those?

From $160-230.

Available in 4S, 5S. and 6S at Impakt.

Well, if the graph is actually true, then they are the same performance as Hyperion G3's, priced 20% higher cost. They are unproven at this point. They look good though.


Metallover, you need to have a graph that has notes about each brand's pack, such as FP and Hyperion have much higher cycle life than other brands, and FP, Neu, Hyp can be charged at 5C rates, etc...

I purchased 2 x 6S 2600mah 35c Flightmax's for $85 each plus shipping from an online store in Hong Kong.

Fullymax, not flightmax. :whistle::wink:

Anyone know what cells SMC uses in their 5200 24C packs?
Has anyone used these? If so, how do they compare to others?

I can hear the difference between 2 amps running the same speakers with the same source material and head unit... I do have an above average IQ, but I doubt that is helping me out much in the listening department...

Nothing against lab equipment, but the human ear is much more sensitive than the best equipment you can find. Plus it can interpret many more variables at the same time than lab equipment. Tube amps sound warmer, different crossover setting impart a different sound and feel. Various digital to analog converters will produce different sounds. I did high end car audio when I was younger and there is a big difference.

And yes, shit can be built cheaper in china than anywhere else... Why do you think most things have made in china stamped on them...

Don't really know, some unknown chinese cells. Freezebyte said he talked to a guy at SMC and said they are coming out with some new packs made with some new gen. cell. I think that's what he said?

Get something else though, such as Neu packs, Hyperion G3's, or even Fullymax packs. The G3 packs are the least expensive of high end packs, and are getting great reviews for both performance and value.

:slap:OZ-RUSTLER

Sorry about that I meant Fullymax.
I posted that 5 in the morning

Oh, no probs. Just don't let it happen again. :whip: