1/8 buggy mamba max esc overheat ?
 

I just got my 1/8 buggy today ( CEN MATRIX ) and the esc overheat badly .. I tried two different mamba max esc and two different motor still the same both motor is ok but esc can goes up to 200f in maybe 2min ... the bec was disabled ... punch control 50% ... motor timing lowest .. start power low ...


NEU 1509 2700KV MOTOR :

Differential Ratio: 2.888888888888889
Transmission Ratio: 1
Other Ratio: 1
Spur Tooth Count: 46
Pinion Tooth Count: 13
Total Voltage: 14.8
Motor KV: 2700
Tire Diameter (inches): 4.3
Tire Ballooning (inches): 0
Motor Current Draw: 0
Motor coil Ω: 0.0082
Spur/Pinion Ratio: 3.54 : 1
Total Ratio: 10.22222 : 1
Tire Circumference (inches): 13.51 inches (343.12 mm)
Total Motor Speed: 39960 RPM
Vehicle Speed: 50.01 mph (80.33 km/h)
Effective KV Value: 2700
KT constant: 0.5 oz-in/A
Motor Torque: Amperage not specified...
Final Torque: Amperage not specified...
Final Power: Amperage not specified...


FEIGAO 8XL MOTOR :

Differential Ratio: 2.888888888888889
Transmission Ratio: 1
Other Ratio: 1
Spur Tooth Count: 46
Pinion Tooth Count: 13
Total Voltage: 14.8
Motor KV: 2084
Tire Diameter (inches): 4.3
Tire Ballooning (inches): 0
Motor Current Draw: 0
Motor coil Ω: 0.0073
Spur/Pinion Ratio: 3.54 : 1
Total Ratio: 10.22222 : 1
Tire Circumference (inches): 13.51 inches (343.12 mm)
Total Motor Speed: 30843.2 RPM
Vehicle Speed: 38.6 mph (62 km/h)
Effective KV Value: 2084
KT constant: 0.65 oz-in/A
Motor Torque: Amperage not specified...
Final Torque: Amperage not specified...
Final Power: Amperage not specified...

Speeds over 30-35mph will tend to overheat a MM. Don't forget it's technically a 10th scale ESC meant for lighter vehicles. Gear down is the answer. Unfortunately, the fairly low reduction in the diff makes this difficult. You are already at 13T. 12T gets you in the 35mph ballpark with the 8XL, but still may be too hot.

I normally would not advise this, but try a fan on the ESC.

Is the Neu a 4 pole motor? If it is, use 15 timing.

It doesn't sound right that your mmm will overheat with your setup.

How heavy is your setup?

The post says a MM, not a MMM.

I dont have any fan and no 12t pinion in hands.. do you think it maybe the center diff fluid ?

I running e-revo and heavier truggy on mamba max and no problems at all dont know why got in trouble with this lighter buggy...

Ok my mistake. I tot you were talking about a MMM.

the stock diff ratio is 2.8 how about if I put my kyosho diff the new ratio is going to be 4.3 .. ?


Differential Ratio: 4.3
Transmission Ratio: 1
Other Ratio: 1
Spur Tooth Count: 50
Pinion Tooth Count: 13
Total Voltage: 14.8
Motor KV: 2700
Tire Diameter (inches): 4.3
Tire Ballooning (inches): 0
Motor Current Draw: 0
Motor coil Ω: 0.0082
Spur/Pinion Ratio: 3.85 : 1
Total Ratio: 16.53846 : 1
Tire Circumference (inches): 13.51 inches (343.12 mm)
Total Motor Speed: 39960 RPM
Vehicle Speed: 30.91 mph (49.65 km/h)
Effective KV Value: 2700
KT constant: 0.5 oz-in/A
Motor Torque: Amperage not specified...
Final Torque: Amperage not specified...
Final Power: Amperage not specified...

OMG, can't beleive I just read that. :lol:

Maybe someone hijacked BrianG's account and is posting crazy things Brian would never say.

Would adding a CAP work to lower temps?

I just setup my Losi 8b with a MM and CC/NEU.

Doesnt get as hot as Jason's, but about 155-160 after 15 minutes. Dont like running Electrics this hot and was thinking of adding a CAP. Then a fan if still too hot...

Would that help?:neutral:

A fan till help the most, but keep in mind they do go bad from the dirt and dust. And 5v DC fans aren't exactly cheap either. If it were me I'd use a fan. I run a small 25mm fan on my MM running 4s in a crt.5 (Neu 1509 motor). I had to use one even with an external BEC. A MM esc just seems to struggle with heat on 4s without major mods.

An external cap would help a bit, needs to be 25-35v, low esr, 105*C, 2000-4000uf.

A small fan would also help; both these mods are 'bread and butter' things you do to the MM to make it work in a 1/8 setup, I wouldnt use it otherwise and just buy a proper 1/8 esc to start with instead..

As for swapping the diffs to lower the ratio, that would actually work rather well, but then you still cant gear to high otherwise temps climb, so the mods mentioned above need to implemented. Mike sells caps, as do Tekin, or hit up DigiKey.

As previously mentioned, a MM will heat very quickly on 4s. Even on 3s, on a 1/8 vehicle it will likely heat up. A fan makes a big difference, but when I had my MM, I found it to heat very quickly even with a large fan blowing above it. 50mph is definitely too tall a gearing and the Feigao may be too inefficient to run the MM on a 1/8 vehicle. Definitely use shorter gearing, but then you give up a lot of speed to keep the MM cool.

What tires are you running? If you have typical 1/8 tires, they are 4.5" and with a little ballooning, you are geared for around 60mph with the 1509... way high unless you are trying to just do some speed passes. Get the 3.3 diffs in it, and drop the pinion a couple teeth. That puts you more like 40mph on the calc which is still fast for a MM/1509 but it's a lot better than 50-60mph

you should add an external bec/ubec, and disable the mm's bec by removing/unplugging the red cable. of course you need some good caps and a fan as well. but that's done quickly. I'm pretty sure the main problem is the build in bec, which is simply not made for 4s and therefore it gets very hot. together with a proper gearing that should be working well. for example, an ezrun 150a has a "switching bec", they don't get that hot on 6s.

I always add some extra caps on my esc's, it gives you some extra protection. they compensate peaks in high voltage.

I never had a problem with dirt on my fans, as almost no dirt gets inside the buggy. you plug the fan into the receiver or connect it directly with the ubec. or get a 12v fan and connect it w/ the battery cables.

I tried the kyosho diff in my buggy ( ratio = 4.3 ) and now the esc temps was cool but I think my 8xl was demagnetized it run cooler and he dont have heavier break power and overheat the esc very fast so I tried my neu 1509 2.5d 2700kv @ 4s it work fine the esc was cool and the batteries too but the motor get hot around 172f I think this can are to small for 1/8 rc's right ? and finaly I run my neu 1515 2.5d 1700kv motor and esc was cool but on 4s the power was not cool its a 5s and 6s motor for sure... later I tried my neu 1509 2.5d 2700kv in my 1/10 e-revo and overheat alot! this can are best for small lightweight rc like traxxas slash or hpi e-firestorm

That all sounds right to me. I have raced a lot with 1515, 1512, 1509 motors, all on 4s and all in the 1700-1900kv range. 1515 2.5d in this video... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I7c-i...e=channel_page

I have also been racing a 1509 (1820kv) recently with some success. It's been running hotter than I like the last few races, with temps as high as 180 (and thus not as efficient as I like) but it's worked really well at some other races, not getting over about 130. 1/8 buggy is pushing what this motor can do, especially if the buggy is NOT light. (My Caster was only 7.5lbs race weight with the 1509 setup) It has plenty of power, but it's not proving to be as efficient. I think a lower kv/6s setup would work pretty good though.

Your 1515 can run great on 4s... just needs more gear. You didn't say what you geared it, but with the kyosho diffs and 46t spur, you need to be at least 16 on the pinion to start getting "fun" speed out of it. Might want to go back to CEN diffs and try it again. :)

I'm going to start running my 1515 again too. :)

Feigao = junk lol

for the neu 1515 on the buggy im running 50t spur ( I used the kyosho center diff also ) and 21t pinion here the info :

Differential Ratio: 4.3
Transmission Ratio: 1
Other Ratio: 1
Spur Tooth Count: 50
Pinion Tooth Count: 21
Total Voltage: 14.8
Motor KV: 1650
Tire Diameter (inches): 4.3
Tire Ballooning (inches): 0
Motor Current Draw: 0
Motor coil Ω: 0.01
Spur/Pinion Ratio: 2.38 : 1
Total Ratio: 10.2381 : 1
Tire Circumference (inches): 13.51 inches (343.12 mm)
Total Motor Speed: 24420 RPM
Vehicle Speed: 30.51 mph (49.01 km/h)
Effective KV Value: 1650
KT constant: 0.82 oz-in/A
Motor Torque: Amperage not specified...
Final Torque: Amperage not specified...
Final Power: Amperage not specified...


motor and speed run cool but im feel a lack of power with this setup...


and for the stock cen diff my mamba max 1/10 esc badly with :\ and for now I cant afford a mamba monster max .. so ill using my regular mamba max..

I run my receiver with a 6v battery pack do I can hook up a 12v fan into the 3rd channel on the receiver ? since the batt tray was used for the battery pack... it may work but at only 6v right ? ( the fan )

That is correct,fan will get 6v.

refurbished MMM sell for 100 dollars from castle.:whistle:

I received my caps today :

http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/9994/capsdra.jpg

which one end are the + & - ?

Positive is the shorter of the 2 leads,to be sure wait for someone to back up my answer.

I soldered the longer lead of the caps on the red wire on the esc and the short lead on the black wire.. it is fine ?

One side of the cap should have a stripe running down it, with - - - inside running in the same direction- that will be on the same side as the negative lead:

http://www.germes-online.com/direct/..._Capacitor.jpg

The shorter leg is usually the negative, so you should be fine.

how do I can be sure the cap work fine ?

the short side is negative....the white strip on the side of the capacitor should confirm this.

I run my MM with a HUGE cap on a 1515 1.5d on 4s in a 12lb maxx. I put a fan on it only after i knew it could run without one. Otherwise the fan is just covering up a "symptom"

ok good it is a 1200UF/35V 105C ELECTROLYLIC CAP enought dont need more right ?

I would use 2 or 3 of them (you got 3 right?) in parallel to get the maximum benefit.

The only way to tell they are working will be a reduction in the esc temps during use, should drop down 15-25*C at best. A small 25-30mm 6v fan on the esc heatsink would be good too.

im really sick of this buggy shit right now

im using a mamba max esc with bec disabled and a 1200uf 25v caps ans still overheat alot I cut a hole on the windshield of the body .. for the motor im using a medusa 36-60-2000v geared for onlu 29mph ...


motor : 167f
esc : 167f
batteries 90f

in about only 5min of runtime..

Differential Ratio: 4.3
Transmission Ratio: 1
Other Ratio: 1
Spur Tooth Count: 50
Pinion Tooth Count: 17
Total Voltage: 14.8
Motor KV: 2000
Tire Diameter (inches): 4.3
Tire Ballooning (inches): 0
Motor Current Draw: 0
Motor coil Ω: 0.006
Spur/Pinion Ratio: 2.94 : 1
Total Ratio: 12.64706 : 1
Tire Circumference (inches): 13.51 inches (343.12 mm)
Rollout: 1.07:1
Total Motor Speed: 29600 RPM
Vehicle Speed: 29.94 mph (48.09 km/h)
Effective KV Value: 2000
KT constant: 0.68 oz-in/A
Motor Torque: Amperage not specified...
Final Torque: Amperage not specified...
Final Power: Amperage not specified...

why people running this motor on big e-revo without any heat issue ? the buggy are not so heavy ... e-revo more weight then this ...

i think somethings off in your buggy.

Is your drive line free? bearings good? motor good?

and you gotta remember the mamba max is a 1/10 scale ESC. Although you can make it work....it requires some close attention

are you running a fan on the heatsink? on the mm it is needed, just a small 25mm 12v fan is the best, hook it right up on the power leads, also drilling holes in the bottom case helps alot to

lmao of all people briang is recommending a fan lol

are you running a fan on the heatsink? on the mm it is needed, just a small 25mm 12v fan is the best, hook it right up on the power leads, also drilling holes in the bottom case helps alot to

--->

I dont run a fan on the mamba only a caps for the motor I tried with a heatsink also still same problems... the mamba max have already hole drilled on in the bottom case...

Andrew32 : Yes the driveline are free all look fine gearmesh was ok too I tried many esc setting and same tried another esc also ...

also the center diff was filled with 100k silicone fluid ... maybe the medusa 36-60 can are to small ? they are like a feigao L series...

lol, you're right. Generally I would never recommend a fan, but then again, I wouldn't recommend a MM for a buggy either. But since he has the MM, the only way I can think of to drastically reduce heat would be to use a fan.

ok for the esc but the motor ? :neutral:

bad motor for my application I suppose ? :) or I know the windings of the motor was some damaged where the motor screws goes ...