New to truggy's - and not real impressed so far
 

Some of you may know that I recently converted an 8T 1.0 using the Tekno kit (long shank pinion set up). I pulled the MMM/Neu 1515 2.5D out of the Revo to use in it, running it on 5S Neu 4900.
I'm geared at 16/47
Center Diff is now fresh with 50K - I havent pulled the front or rear yet.
I had it out for a few minutes last night to just run it up and down the street to get a feel for the gearing and check temps.
Anyway, I'm less than impressed with the off the line pop, acceleration, and overall feeling of speed. This is in comparison to the way my Revo ran with the same motor, my Flux (maybe not a fair comparison), and my past Maxx's and other rigs.
I dont recall what my settings on the MMM were - but I know I have never turned down the punch control more than 10 to 20%.

Is this "normal" for a truggy? What steps does one take to give it that "out of control" acceleration feeling that we are all so attracted to? I assume that going up in diff oil weight is the only mechanical tuning solution - besides gearing. BTW, with the Tekno set up, and the 47 tooth spur, it looks like 14 or 15 is the smallest pinion I can run - my 13 wouldnt engage. I do have a 48T Robison spur that I can put on there also....

Have you considered that the truggy is just accelerating efficiently? Might looks slower because it doesnt yank the front wheels. Also the center diff could be unloading..

sounds like he center diff is unloading on you

"out of control" is not what the truggy is about.

How are temps?

whats the diff ratio in the 8T?

50k is too much

I run 20-20-5 in my truggy and I am limited just by traction as far as acceleration goes.

Your acceleration is being limited by your CD. If you like the way a MT/Revo accelerates, either lock the CD or put much thicker oil in it. I personally like 120k+, but I'm not a racer either.

Definitely a difference when going from tranny's to CD's....

Is that what she said?

the wheelie inducing high center of gravity and short wheelbase of Mts is probably giving the illusion of bettery acceleration.

I agree with brushlessboy16 - the truggy with 50k is likely faster and quicker than the MT, but the low Cg, extra length and controlled fashion in which a truggy gets the power to the ground makes it "appear" slower. Lock the center diff, install stiff springs with lots of preload and lighter weight shock oil, heavier diff oil all around and disable punch control(basically detune the truggy) and you should get a more sketchy, out of control feel. Or.....utilize the enhanced handling capabilities to allow even more power! :)

Yep.

Glad to see you posting Mike!

And I've kept that mindset so far - hence why I'm asking if what I'm sensing so far is "typical" difference between truggies and MT's.

Temps were very cool - but ambient temp was about 60 and I only ran it for about 5 minutes or so. I suspect I can gear for higher speed and not have an issue.

I agree that it would likely be faster on the track - but I'm like Brian - I've never set foot on a track so far (dont even have one within 30 miles of me - seems everyone in Seattle is a carpet racer), and just trying to wrap my brain around the nuances of these center diff systems.

I do like to have the ability to run on the edge if/when I want. I dont like wheelies so much - which I why I wanted to try a truggy, and to get a feel for thier durability compared to my MT's.

I'll stop and pick up some heavier oils to try, and double check my MMM settings. After reading through the link someone posted about diff set ups, if I run up to 100+ on the center, what I have in the front/rear doesn't really matter (within reason) except for tuning the cornering, right?

I also have an RCM mount for it. However with the layout of the Tekno chassis, it looks as though I would need to mount it "backwards" to keep the motor in the right rear corner. The motor fastener heads wouldn't be in the slots in the mount, but other than that, anyone know if having the mount backwards would cause any issues? The only reason I'd throw it in is to give myself the ability to drop down in pinion size (better acceleration, right??)

Yeah, like you, I mostly bash. Even when I do play at a track, it's not at an actual race, just play. I too wanted a vehicle that was lower sprung, more durable, and more easily fixed (easy disassembly), but with monster truck usage. I find that 120k CD oil allows for great acceleration while taming the wheelies. Also help reduce front wheel ballooning. I can still wheelie if I want to, but I have to try.

With the 1521 1y 6s powered muggy I use a mixture of 50 and 100k in the CD. Ending up with something like 75-80k. That works alot better than the 50k did, and still allows for tight turning (on higher traction surfaces). I run 30k in the diffs, but I also run heavier tires and wheels, so I need thicker fluid to keep from diff-ing out. I mainly run on the road and thru grass so thicker fluid benefits my environment.

Comparing the muggy with the lst (about as close as you will get as they share almost everything save for the chassis) the Muggy does feel much more planted, turns alot better, and jumps almost as well. Either will show up a maxx/revo during bashing, just no comparison. The lst is more "fun" as it is a bit taller and will flip easier, so it keeps me on my toes. Tire selection makes the biggest difference.

As far as turning with a locked (or very thick oil) CD, I prefer the method where I apply the brake while turning. On grass or asphalt, this results in the truggy just about pivoting around on the inner front tire.

Thats they advantage of the 3 diff setup. I was able to do this with both my buggy and truggy and able to spit out faster track times.

The truggy was fun but not for me. I enjoyed racing my buggy MUCH more than the truggy for some reason. They just seemed a whole lot quicker all around and more durable.

I've got some fairly heavy ones on it right now also - bead locks with some mulchers (not 40 series).

Dude - I dont think I've been able to recall anything you've typed since you changed your avitar......

You guys should check out Dafni's avatar. Very nice as well.

In my Basher LightningStadiumPro2 I'm running 30K/F, 100K/C, 50K/R so far very happy. No unloading and great steering and better climbing.

Heavy diff oil bad for motor?
 

I always thought that running thicker oil in the center diff and the fr/rr diffs puts more strain on the motor resulting in higher temps all around. I also thought that putting something like 120k in the CD would transfer more power to the rear wheels resulting in more wheelies, the opposite of what Brian said "taming the wheelies."

I'm running a Losi 8T with the 2200 combo and am looking for the best setup. I strickly drive on asphalt. I currently have 10/30/5 and it is accellerates very fast. Talking to engineers at Castle and others, they told me not to go much higher than 30k in the center diff due to the added strain on the motor. They also told me to go a little heavier in the rear if I am strickly bashing on asphalt-to help the rear end break loose a bit in
corners (more fun).

I have some 120k laying around, but don't want to compromise the life of the motor. I'm running 40 series road rage tires, so maximum transfer to the rear wheels is ideal.

Any help on fr/ctr/rr diff oil thickness for street bashing is appreciated?

I felt that same way back when I converted my truggy. It just didn't have it for me. I was only running 4s 1515 1y at the timer. I guess I was expecting something more from the truggy vs the G3R which was the only other comparison I had for it. Well that and the way it ran with the Axial .28 on it was pretty impressive. It was fast but it wasn't quick enough I guess. I unconverted it back for now and plan on trying it again someday. I am interested in how this turns out for you Jeff.

Um - the way I read Brians comments were that the higher weights would put you closer to wheelies, not less likely.

I'm fairly certain that I'll get it tuned - I have faith in oil!!!

The thick in the center distributes the power to F&R more evenly, hardley any diff unloading in the front unless I run 5s and Really hammer on it.

I salute you, right back at you :party:

I just forgot something.....cant remember what.....

What do you mean Mr. Thiessen? :lol:

What is your FDR? If you don't load the motor up enough, sometimes it feels a bit sluggish. You may want to try going up some teeth, load the motor, pull more amps and power out of the motor. My trug is geared ~12-13:1, where as I tended to have the revo geared at 15-16:1.

IDK the diff ratio for the 8t's, but I did assume a worst case 4.11 ratio, and you are in a good range. Perhaps it is more psychological then...

I love how chics making out is ok, but an animated gif of kermie humping a stuffed bunny is a no-no....

Not that I am complaining about the chics making out, that is always welcome in my book!

As for heavy cd fluid, it will put down the power better to all 4 tires, and prevent alot of front tire wear from excessive unloading. Plus if the front tires are unloading too much, you will have heat issues with the motor. I had a half full cd with 50k in it in my muggy, and with the hacker c50 11xl temps were too high for my liking (beating 140 after a few mins) I check the cd as I could see the front tires were blowing up, even at full speed, and found it half full. I topped it off with 100k, and the motor temps came down, plus the tire ballooning was alot less. Yes, it would wheely from a standstill, but what do you expect from a 4hp setup in a 12lb truck with lots of traction? I did not notice any differnce in turning circle or steering with the thicker fluid, as it will still let the ft and rr diffs spin at different speeds off power. The heavier truggy size wheels and tires do have quite a bit of momentum, so they can overcome the heavier fluid in the CD just fine.

Keep in mind this is with a muggy, and not a truggy, but I do run regular MT badlands (taped and balanced) so tire weight should be similar. And this is mixed bashing on the street and in the grass. A slicker surface would allow more tire slip, and you could drop the CD fluid weight for better steering/turning. My mixture in the muggy CD also does well with the 1521 1y on 6s, geared 15/49.

Its 12.6:1. I've got that 48T supr that I can throw on it - other than that, I need to order some more of those long shanks.

I think a losi smart diff would help as far as locking the CD on acceleration (aleast i think thats right)

I thought I had read some reports on the smart diff that claimed it was more sluggish - but I can't be 100% certain of that.

Have I told ya'll how much I despise the closest LHS to me?

I stopped in on the way home today to pick up some 100wt. I looked around a bit, didn't see any so I asked the kid. He kinda looked at me and walked over to these little tubes of grease and said - "Diff's dont use oil, you just use the lithium grease". I must have given him my special "look", 'cause he asked "So hat are you trying to put oil in? Diff's only take grease." I started to explain, and he got an even funnier look when I said the word Truggy, and he said -"Oh, we dont carry those brands".........ugghghhhhhh!

Kids like that give us LHS employees a bad rep. He should come visit the store I work at, he'd leave after just a few hours :lol:

i have a smart diff in my center truggy and still get balloonage a little, they dont lock up 100%

Smart diff's don't result in faster lap times, this has been proven over and over.. but past that typical smart diffs result in ~12k on throttle and around 4k off throttle obviously depending on your springs and how many etc etc.


20k center w/ the 2.5d should be sufficient, but with a 1y you need around 30k to keep the unloading on the fronts to a minimum.

I have 20-20-5 diff setup with slipperential and no unloading with Low Profile racing tires

yea i read that stum, i just got the truggy like this and win every race ive been to with it almost, so i dont wanna change it lol

If it aint broke don't fix it :)

I got out this afternoon to run the 8T in the dirt today, and I must say that I'm more impressed now. It turns great in the dirt, and for acceleration, it outran the brother in laws HV4.5 in his emaxx fairly easily (which it should have, I know). No, its not the brute force that the Flux and the Revo displayed, but its damn quick. Handling was noticably better in the dirt than it was on grass, and had just a little unloading of the front tires if I really ran it hard.

Glad to hear it !

Just wanted to update with my experience with the 8T so far.

Had the 8T out at the beach over the last week along with my Revo conversion, the Flux, my relatives FLM Maxx, and an E-revo. Well, some of you may have read my update on the Flux and the FLM/LST shocks (not good so far). I have to say that far and away, this 8T is great. It was easily the fastest of the bunch on the track we made in the hardpack sand, and held up great - until I decided to send it off a ramp over the break wall by the beach (it was about an 8 - 10 foot drop onto the soft sand). Something, somewhere inside the diffs or the motor got bound up. It runs, but it when you let off on the throttle, it completely locks up the wheels (I did have motor braking set to about 10 or 20 percent - but after the jump, its like its on 100%). With everything off, I cant push it by hand at all. I pulled the center out and checked it, but it was fine. I'll have to pull the front and rear to see what those look like - I needed to do that anyway, since I never opened those up after I bought it.

One thing I'd like to try to do with this thing is to find a way to put some different shocks on it so that I can also make it a little more bash friendly - ie., get it up off the ground a little more.