Upgrade to a Lehner... Which One?
 

OK I think Im ready to upgrade to a Lehner 19 series motor in my E-Revo. I want to find a setup that will be able to run my entire 8000mah 5s lipo packs in hard bashing conditions with out stoping to let the motor or ESC cool down. I'm lookin for advice on which size and wind to choose. I want to get the best setup I can at this point I'm tired of always walking the line with heat. Granted I don't want to replace everything. Just the motor. Cool and Stable is my goal. However, I would like to make sure I keep at least 40-45 mph as a top end. I bash w/ nitros frequently and still want to be able to keep up on the top end.

Here is my current setup. I would like to be able to just keep the setup I have and put in a new motor, spurs and pinions.

E-Revo G-Maxx chassis w/ Gmaxx Motor Mount
580C-9XL
Quark MonsterPro 125 w/ heatsink and fan
2 Speed Emaxx Tranny - Ultramaxxed
70/24 32P Gearing
RRP Slipper Kit (I have a Strobe in the package still, will be upgrading with this rebuild)
TrueRC 8000mah 3s + 2s Packs.
RRP- Rear Diff gears w/ Aulm. Cups and Case
MIP CVD Rear / Stock Sliders Front
Dual 5925MG steering Servos
M8 Radio w/Spektrum


I am planning on continuing to run the 5s packs for the most part, I would however like to be able to run a 6s setup ocasionally (just for showing off to the nitro guys).

My initial thoughts are to go for the 1950-7. I am a little concerned about the sheer size of the motor. Looks really big and really heavy. Would a 1940 can due just as well for me? I don't really want ot get into making support brackets for the back of the motor and such.

Just looking for some input to make sure I make the right choice. To me this is a lot of cash to drop on just a motor, so I want to make sure I make the right choice.

I would choose the 1950/8 if you plan on going with 6S sometimes. It should run cool and fast.

Do the charts for Lehner show loaded or unloaded kv #'s?

Also what kind of gearing would I want to run w/ that using a 51t Spur?

Loaded. on a revo, not quite sure, but maybe 18/51 should be a good start.

I would try 16 and 18 to begin with.

I think Mike used the 1930 in an E-Maxx or Revo of his, so the 1940 should be enough.

My calculations say that the 1950/8 on 5s with 18/51 gearing is only a 37mph setup. I am planning on running 5s 95% if the time. I'm thinking that the 1950-7 sounds like a better perofmrnace setup. How much diferance in heat would there be between the 2?

WOuld a 1940/9 be worse. Its kind in between the other 2 as far as KV rateing.

The 1940 would run hotter. The 1950 is the way to go. Which wind is up to you.

But how much hotter? I would think the 1940 should be enough, is it not?

Not sure but the 1950 will handle the heavy truck for sure. Keep in mind that the G2R's aren't light by any means.

What about a Hacker C50-9XL? Its a 1804kv motor about the same size as the Lehner 1950. Anyone have an idea how well that would run on 5s?

Not much better than a Feigao 9XL....There pretty much identical inside. It migh run cooler than the standard. About the same as the C version...

So on 5s will I have a problem with heat with the 1950-7. Or am I better off playing it safe and going 1950-8. I just feel like the 8 will not get to 40 on 5s.

No, you shouldn't have a problem with 5S on a 7 turn, maybe on 6S.

Either motor will easily reach 40-50 mph on 5s Lipo. Just a matter of gearing.

So gearing up a 1950-8 will not cause excessive esc heat? The whole reason I want to upgrade is to avoid heat. I feel like Im constantly walking the line of to much heat in either the motor or esc.

On 5s (18.5v) the 1950-8 will only be spinning at around 30k rpm. The 1950-7 will be at about 35K rpm. Will I have a problem with the 1950-8 not hitting its sweetspot ''powerband'' at only 30K rpm?

Which of the 2 would be better for nice cool running and 40-45 mph but still have nice punch? Any sugested gearing for the 2 motors for 40-45 top end on 5s? I'm running a Gmaxx revo with an emaxx tranny and revo diffs and a Quark 125.

My calculations say that it would need to be arond 51/18-20 on the 1950-7, and 51/20-22 on the 1950-8 to reach 40-45mph on 5s. Does this sound reasonable?

Yea, that sounds about right. I run a 10XL (somewhere inbetween the 2 as far as KV) and it runs pretty cool on 16 cells geared 20/51.

I see that the Lehner 1950s are all called out as 1800 watts and the 1940s are listed at 1450 watts. What are the Feigao XLs?

Can anyone give me an assesment from experience on how ''powerful'' the Feigao XL motors are vs a Lehner 1950. How are the 1940s vs the 1950s. I'm assuming that both the 1940 and 1950 are more powerfull than the XL's.

Just trying to get a feel for how much more powerful a lehner might be vs a feigao XL.

The XL's I believe have around 1800 watts also. Not positive on that. But the main thing about the 1950's is that they have segmented magnets, run cooler, smoother, and more efficient.

To make things more confusing, I emailed Mike about getting a 1950/8 and he said it may be awhile, and that he was going with Neu motors now. More efficient and cheaper than the Lehner he thinks. It's a 4 pole design and looks to have an open endbell from what I've seen, but there sure are a lot of choices in that brand, that's for sure. I dunno which one would match to a 1950/8 though, Mike never got back to me on that one.

http://www.fastelectrics.com/blmotors.asp

I'm thinking a 1515/2.5D or 1515/1Y? Looks like they are available with cooling fins, too. I'd buy it from Mike of course, just sharing the motors I've found so far.

The 1515/1Y is tyhe motor I have been running - around 2200 Kv. The 1515/2.5d would be similar to the 1950/8, bu the Neu motors have a little more torque so you can actualy push the a little further than the Lehners. I will get a few choices when they arrive. I will still carry the Lehner motors as well, so the 1950/8 isn't going anywhere. The Neu motors have a few advanatgages, though, so I will stock these up first - anyone needing the 1950/8 will certainly be taken care of.

the feigao xls are probably rated for around 1200-1500 watts or so. Don't let that figure get stuck in your mind, though. The Feigao xl motors will feel similar to the 1950 motor in power output - it will just overheat and fail much sooner.

Mike, how do the Nue motors like the 9920? As long as it doesn't cog worse than an XL (which doesn't hardly cog at all)...

Neu motors are 4pole, the 9920 doesn't like 4pole motors.

Exactly - the BK controllers run the Neu motors, but they end up with the strange breaking phenomenon that the MGM controller had before the recent software update(if you coast before braking, the rotor locks when you hit the breaks).

When will the Neu motors be in stock, Mike?

Next week with any luck.

I'm also curious when the Neu motors will be in stock. If the price tag on the 1515/1y (seems to be the best motor all around for 4s Lipo) isn't too bad, I might consider saving up for one for my new 1/8 buggy.

EDIT:
Nevermind, Mike beat me to it.

So the Quark is the chioce for running these Neu motors?

If it is.... It looks like I will be trying one of these ''new'' :rolleyes: Neu motors as well.

The price list on www.neumotors.com lists the 15 seris Neu motors at $280. So they should be cheaper than the Lehner 1950's.

The Quark and MGM controllers both work well with the Neu motors. They are the best available motor IMO. Lehner "19" motors are still high on the list, but the Neu motors are more for less or the same for less - and they have slightly longer threads for the motor mount screw area as well. I am extremely impressed with my current setup on my g-maxx. I haven't gotten either component over 145F during hard running in relatively hot weather.

Did you dialed back your system, Mike?

They look nice. You got the one with the heatsink, right?

Hey mike, I ordered a Neu 1512 (1900kv) a few days ago for my 1/8 buggy and maybe a future truggy project. I'm glad to hear you will have them soon... I would have waited a week if I would have known...

It's a shot in the dark, but I thought the shorter 1512 would work fine in a buggy. I hope I didn't screw up not getting a 1515. What do you think? Have you run a 1512 yet?

These look to be awesome motors and a good guy building them too. Better than importing stuff from europe... no offense to you euro dudes. ;)

I can say yes, it is. I have a Emaxx with that 1950/8, UE diffs, gorilla single speed trasmission
and strobe with mod1 spur. I run 5S lipo. With a 18T pinion I stay under 54°C on the ESC and
the motor.
Its power is impressive, you can wheelie while running from over middle throttle without
problems. It's also very fast. Do not know exactly, but it seems to me to be able to reach
70, 80 km/h on bad terrain.

In my bashing yard, the 18T is perfect. But I think you can reach 100 km/h or something
like that with a 20T pinion without loosing in torque.

I love Lehner motor just because they do not get hot, and they also keep the esc
temperature more than reasonable. In my brushless experience, the thermalling problem
is at the top list of the iussue of this technology.

Ciao,
Daniele

LOL!

I would love to try some of their motors. By cooncidence, i was just going thru their motors, and i personally was having doubts what motor would be nice for a buggy/lightweight maxx. the 1512 should be more than enough, but the torque of the 1515 would be awesome. and Mike has got a good experience with the 1515's. I guess you can't really buy a wrong type of motor for a buggy.

On how many cells are you going to use it?

@daniele;

it sure is, that thermalling thing!

I designed my 1/8 buggy to work with standard 6 cell race packs or two lipo packs of similar size. I think I have ditched running nimh for the most part, so it's 4s lipos now.

I want to stick with 4s lipos to make things simple, but I could always change that. I might actually try a 3s if this thing has crazy power for my smallish track, like my franken-hacker motor I've been running. The buggy is just retarded fast on the maxamps 4s 6000s. And it's thermalling at about 6-7 minute mark under race conditions.

The controllers I have now don't like 5s and 6s. I think lower kv motors and 6s is the way to go but I can't do that now unless my new 125b decides it wants to be good to me.

I got a quick test run with a Feigao 9L and it runs strong, and it gave the MGM the same fits as my hacked hacker 12x.

The smaller Neu motor should do just fine in the buggy - it would probably do very well in an emaxx as well - It doesn't seem like I am even giving my motor a workout.
rene - I didn't dial it back except with gearing - the Quark controller i smooth enough and I only am running 4s Lipo.