Nice little lipo
 

Here is the scenario. I'm testing 2 11.1V 2200mAh packs that I'm thinking of bringing them to the US. I've made 2 runs with them and the numbers are looking good so far. I used my Ofna MBX with the BK 3695, Hacker C50-13L to test this little packs. I know for sure they can put out 128A burst. On graph A I only ran the buggy for around 15 minutes. Now the second run was done today and I ran until I noticed the speed decreasing, but I just went a tad more to around 24 minutes to see what the packs would do. They did swell up just a bit which has occurred to other bigger capacities packs I have, but it is expected for them to expand a little as the datasheet of most lipos shows a +- on the dimensions. Now this are 2200mAh, but on the second run it shows that I took out 3658mAh and the minimum voltage was 7.14V. I've had my share of lipos and most went bad and some went dead. I know most of you think the packs are dead, but they are not. I waited until they were cool and put one pack on my AF109 and it showed 9.58V. After the pack is done charging I will post how many mAh it took in.

The pack took in 2090mAh. I will charge the other pack later today to see what it takes in.

I just put the other pack in the charger and it showed 9.88V. I will post again after it is done charging to see how many mAh it took in.

that is some incredible batteries. I got a plane shop here testing some that they claim you don't need a LVC and they don't heat up or swell, Just run till you see a difference then change. He has doubled his flight times, just swapping to these batteries. didn't have a wrapper to identify them though

It could either be KongPower or Airthunder. This packs I have are made from the same OEM that provides the batteries to those companies.

Took the other pack of the charger and it took in 2051mAh. I will run the MaxAmps 11.1V 4000mAh packs I have just for a little comparison.

Let me get this straight, you burned 3600 mah and took 2000 in? That sounds like getting something for nothing, thats almost impossible. Good find, i might have to try some

I actually pushed them a lot more than I would have with other packs. I thought that was strange, but it might be a misreading on the DPR-II-150. The first few graphs everything seems to line up right, but now as you can see the Max 128A doesn't line up with the graph. I tried downloading the newest firmware again to see if it helped, but it didn't.

I ran the MaxAmps 11.1V 4000mAh packs yesterday and it didn't perform like the smaller 11.1V 2200mAh packs did. I had to stop at around 8 minutes due to the packs heat and a swelling issue that was uncomfortable to see. The swelling has gone down and they charged ok, but I'll just run them on my Stampede from now on LOL. I will run the KongPower 11.1V 2200mAh today and see the results they give me.

were you running th 2200 packs in parallel? Thats the only way I could see these things putting out that kind of amp and run time. On a 2200mah pack 128Amps would be 58C and the total discharge of 3600+ mah makes no sense.

These must be paralle numbers. which bring the peak discharges down to a more reasonable 29C

I was running them in series. The voltage was at a little over 25V. I was going to compare them with the KongPower 11.1V 2200mAh packs also in series, but I forgot to turn off my rx pack and I drained it, but I'll run it tomorrow.

Some pictures of the set up.

Some more.

erh; i see a 15V dip on a 112A load. for a 6S pack that is hitting bottom (and beyond) 18V should be the CV, at 50A (rather fresh charged) they hit their limit. (18V) 50A is roughly 22C. Good to see they hold up though, but tourturing them like this will shorten their lifespan for sure!

You should def. use them in 2P in your application.

I'm doing this torture test to see if the claims are correct. This have the same ratings as the KongPower and Airthunder packs. They are supposed to be true 25C continuous discharge with 50C+- bursts. I will run the KongPower 11.1V 2200mAh packs in a few minutes and I'll post the graph of that run.

They are not capable of 50C bursts, observing your graphics; they are 25C burst. (would be nice if a lipo company would define their 'burst' i know Flightpowers keep their voltage above 3V on a 50C burst. (at least that's what they claim)

hey Serum... this is a little off topic.. but do you have any info on Flightpower as far as cycle life and/or safety of their cells?

Try contacting them (the guys in the UK) they are always willing to help you out!

I would say they are 50C burst mainly because the max AMP was 128A+ and 128/2.2=58.18.

Without a set load, those graphs really don't say much about the battery and how it performs. A real discharge graph, discharging at a set load of 10C or 20C would be far more useful in determining the abilities of a battery. You're halfway there, because you already have the datalogging bit of it, you just need a big honkin' load to put across the battery and see how it responds. If you've got the temp attachment, you can use that, and get a temp response graph along with it.

I was going to get a CBA, but I figured that a heavy 1/8 scale buggy would be enough. I have the temp probes for the DPR, but it just add more wires and the batteries only get warm after each run.

I don't want to burst your bubble; but at this 50C burst the voltage drops to 14V. at 6S that's 2.33V, not capable of 50C at all.

Serum,

No one is bursting my bubble. Like I said before, I'm just testing the limits of the batteries. The manufacturer claims they can go to 2.2V safely. I will get one of my touring car out to test it on that as well.

You must admit, that this is an odd way to get the C rating up? it's cool that they stay cool and don't get swollen, but a lipo below 3V is shortened in lifespan.

Yea, even if the battery can drop below 3 volts without any harm at all.... that is not the standard we use to rate lipos.

Also, at such a low voltage performance takes a noticeable hit.

The absolute minimum acceptable would be 3.0 per cell, and we really like to see like 3.2 or so...

I'm just doing this to see if what they claim is true. They say the cells can go as low as 2.2V. I'm not doing this to make everyone go out and try it with their lipos. A few other people in other forums are having great results with this new lipos. The 11.1V 2200mAh packs that I have does out perform my 11.1V 4000mAh MaxAmps.

That doesn't surprise me.. what series of 4k's maxamps have you got? older ones?

Agreed. One of the great benefits is the low voltage drop. I woudn't want a pack that drops that low under load, regardless of it's ability to not self-destruct. I'd consider that pack's abilities more of a safety margin in discharging, rather than a higher C rating.

The point of me doing this is to see how much abuse this packs can take. This packs were not meant for this kind of use. They are being used in helicopters with great succes. In one graph I ran for over 20mins. without an isseu.

True... although we don't want to have any pack fall on it's face like that, or give it any sort of "c" rating.... it's very nice to know that it won't do any damage.

It's not cool worrying about ruining a $200-300 battery simply by running it a bit too long.

I'm basically saying what the manufacturers are stating. They claim a treu 25C continuous discharge and 50C bursts. KongPower also makes a 5000mAh pack. I like the 2200mAh because of its weight. It kind of gives us the edge when we race those nitro bullies.

What dimensions are the 2200s?

And how much per cell for a small order?

Here are the dimensions for the 11.1V 2200mAh:

Size:110(L)x34(W)x28(H)mm
Weight:195g

I'm still testing the KongPower packs to see how well they will suit the vehicles. I know readyheli.com is a distributor as of now.

Any new news on this?

I have (6) 3S 2200Mah Air thunder batteries for my Trex 450.

Another great thing about Air thunder and Kong power is if you do puff them/damage them, they will replace them at half the cost.

So Air thunder http://www.airthunder.com/ sells the 3S2200 Mah for $65:
http://www.airthunder.com/catalog01/...products_id=33

and Kong power sells the 3S 2200Mah for $65:
http://www.readyheli.com/Kong_Power_.../kp-2225-3.htm

From my understanding, Air thunder came out first. then Readyheli started selling the kongpowers afterwards. That made Air thunder put this statement on their homepage: "Recently, one of our competitors has been spreading untrue rumor about us, claiming they manufacture our packs and implying we have inferior products. AirThunder hereby dispute any such claims. etc. etc. etc" you can read the full thing at the air thunder homepage.
Here is official release from airthunder where their packs come from:
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread....ght=airthunder
I have no Idea if they are the same as kong powers. Any one else know?

This was a good thing for us consumers because it brought the price of these packs down about $10 since I first got them.

Also if you read this: (note this guy is sponsered by kong power, but it seems to be the general consensus...)
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=50464
He logs 3 seperate of the kong power batteries.
he comes down to the conclusion that the best way to treat these batteries is just like any other LIPO, obey the 80% rule (means if you have a 1000mah lipo, you should only be putting 800mah back in the pack when you charge it.) and the other thing is charge is at 2C or below. He was charging one at 3C and that seemed to damge the battery fastest.


I just like to not worry about ruining some batteries if I discharge them below 3V per cell.

Kongpower and Airthunder both buy cells and/or packs from the same manufacturer. I have packs from Kongpower, but I also have packs from another supplier that might use the same cells. I ran that pack in my Ofna buggy with great success and it was able to deliver 128A bursts and I ran them for 23 minutes on grass. The only problem is that this one supplier didn't provide me with references and I don't want to dump a few thousand and then nothing arrives. I asked them for NET terms and they wouldn't agree with a NET15 and I usually work with NET30 from my suppliers of electronic components. All I can tell you is that if I had this supplier send me the packs, I would be able to sell much cheaper then Airthunder.

Another heli site that has jumped on the band wagon of no puff lipos

They are called Lightning Power, same spec, price, so im sure they are the same packs as air thunder and kong power:
http://helihobby.com/html/lithium_batteries.html
(you have to scroll down a wee bit)

I would have placed an order from the supplier I have, but they wouldn't send me any trade references. All I can say is that my prices would be around $50-55 for the 3S 2200mAh packs. You can see them in this video:
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In the first post you can see I ran them for 23 minutes.

what are trade references?

People who bought from them. It's basically a way to find out if your supplier is what they say they are and will actually deliver the goods after you send a few thousand deep one to them.