Possible Kontronic HV purchase...
 

Really thinking about buying this:

http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...?&I=LXGCX1&P=7

I have two 5s lipos and an aveox 1300 kv motor, I would like to put it in my hyper 7. Been itching to try out a hv setup and 10s is HV! Already have the mount, parts, etc. Figured that I could find a use for the 1800kv motor too, maybe in one of my stampedes, or a 5s setup in a light emaxx. Anyone have any thoughts on this? Keep in mid that I will not be paying the list price!!

I would go for a bk 3695 and a Neu motor. Enables you to use motorbrakes for a tad more money.. Shoot Mike an email, i am sure he can help you out, i think he has got something laying around..

The BK 3695 is only good for 42K rpm with a 2 pole motor. I have one in my Ofna buggy with a Hacker C50 13L and it almost at the rpm limit. That Jazz controller is a well built machine. You will like it a lot. I have a few of them.

since you can choose the kv of the motor you don't need to worry about that.

But it doesn't work AT ALL with the neu though, i forgot about that.

Point is you can get a normal car setup at about the same price.

the 42K limit isn't a big deal, lower KV/more torque..

The Jazz 55-10-32 has 2 car modes. one with proportional brakes and reverse and one without reverse. I use the first mode and can lock all 4 wheels on tarmac with a 1:8 Buggy if i hit the brakes to hard.

My Neu 1512/2y (1400kv) already spins at 42000-44000rpm with 10s A123 (= 8s lipo) @10A. Your aveox 1300kv motor would spin at almost 50000rpm with 10s lipos. That seems crazy high. A lower KV motor (around 1000kv) would be a better fit for 10s. Or use this motor with 8s.

The BK ESC would only spin a 2 pole motor @42000rpm. Like Lutach already mentioned with Jazz controllers you are buying a quality product. Never heard of any Kontronik ESC going up in smoke (like schultzes, BKs, Castles ...).

My main desire was to try a 10s system and also give kontronik products a try. I had figured that a l can length motor on 10s will be sufficient to run a light buggy to around 40mph. My 5s packs are good for about 50amps continuous, which should be ok. Everyone here who has a kontronic esc seems to like it and I know that aveox make good motors. Figured I would give it a try.

Hmm, looks like i am starting to suck more and more..

i assumed it was an airplane controller..

why is there a special car version of the jazz 55 and the 70?

Thats ok, we all get old:rofl:

Just joking.

I figured that it was worth a try as the whole setup will cost about the same as a 1515 neu motor by itself!:oops:

Kind of like the old quark air masters that had all of the programming in them and you just selected what application you were going to use from a menu. This is nice as most companies charge a premium for their car software and do not give a choice in controller usage.

so no technical or software differences in both controllers?

Those ESC have more car modes and are intended for 1:10 cars. They have a cell limit of 10 cells (NICD/NIMH).

But besides the software the Jazz 80 and jazz 70 car is identical. Some guy in germany even uses his Jazz 70 with 12 cells NimH.

All Jazz controllers (without the car extension) are multipurpose ESC which have 2 car, heli and Aircraft modes.

Jazz ESC are picking up momentum in germany when it comes to 1:8 car use. Most guys use the Jazz 80 with a Fun 600/21 (or 25) in their Emaxx, Ezillas, twinforce or 1:8 Buggys with 4s lipos. My first setup im my buggy was a Jazz 80 with a fun 600/25 and 12 cells Nimh. This components still are working great in my Ezilla. But the Kontronik motor is not as efficient as a Neu and will heat up (thus needs a fan and/or heatsink). Due to the Amps flowing (around 100A burst) when only using 4s the Jazz 80 needs at least a heatsink.

Kontronik btw doesn't recommend Jazz ESC (without car extension) for car use.

Great info. Will try that controller with a low KV neu.

Good info on the motor as well. Do you know what type of segmented rotor they use? sliced or sintered?

Sounds like the motor is less ideal than i hoped for. Guess the price says it all, you get what you pay for, right?..

What is the car extension?

So the motors are not a good a a neu, but i am sure that they are better than a feigao motor?!

The only problem I had with the Jazz 55 was when I tried it with the Align 600L motor on 36V. It stopped working, but I guess it was my fualt. I ran the 40 HV controller with the BPP truck and the only thing that went wrong with it was the capacitor. Kontronik makes solid controllers, but the price is up there as well.

What about this monster? http://www2.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin...&P=SM&I=LXSDV4 It ha scar software also?

The Power Jazz 63V doesn't have car software. I tried asking Mike at Kontronik if he can add the car software to it and he said it would take 4-6 weeks, but I haven't heard anything yet from him.

I would like to get a Power Jazz 63V, tell him you know another person interested in getting one, maybe it will speed them up. PM me if you hear from them
Thanks

@lincpimp
with "car" extension i meant those ESC which have "car" at the end of their labelling -> Jazz 70 "car".

The Fun 600 motors are somewhere between a feigao L can and lehner/Neu. We already discussed the Fun 600 motor in this thread.

@Serum
I posted a picture of the rotor (from kontroniks website) on the above mentioned thread. Maybe you can tell from the picture if they are sintered or sliced. They for sure are not as segmented as lehner rotors and don't look sliced to me.

Before using a neu 1521 with 10s1p A123, i tried a fun 600/11 (1100kv) which only survived 4 runs (it was preowned so maybe it already had some kind of issue). Right in the middle of my last run with the fun 600/11, rpms rose dramatically and i couldn't start the car from a standstill without cogging. On my eagletree graphs i had Amp spikes of 70A (around 1800W). Before this event it never drew more than 40A. Temperature measured on the heatsink was at 65°C (149°F). So maybe i possibly demagnetised the rotor or a wind shorted because the seal overheated. I never expected this to happen (not at this temperature level). So what i learned from this lesson was: you have to properly cool those Fun 600 motors. The fun 600/11 would have needed a fan on top of the heatsink.

Those are the graphs from the last run of my fun 600/11
-> look at the last rpm spike at the end
http://bt2007.braintrust.at/ds/rc/fu...fahrprofil.gif

-> before i understood what has happened i tried to spool up the motor a few times: look at the amp draw (Watts), RPMS and motor temperature
http://bt2007.braintrust.at/ds/rc/fun600_11_exitus.gif

Don't get me wrong. I don't want to say those are bad motors. My fun 600/25 still runs great today, but it gets hot and needs good cooling. After a 10 minute run in my Ezilla i can't touch the motor longer than for 1 second although i use a 50x50 pc fan above it.

He is not replying to my e-mails LOL. I even went to rcgroups to ask for it there.

I ran the FUN600-15 with 10S A123 on my BPP truggy and it lasted a little longer than yours. They are good motors, but I think the Neu is the way to go. I had my first downfall with my old 1412 1y Aveox, but it is only the shaft that came unglued.

the Power Jazz 63V should work fine with mechanical brakes right?

Yes, it will work. It also works with a pistol radio.

Yeah, that kontronik HV controller looks nice. I went and looked around hoping to find something about running it in a car, but no luck either.

If the controller is as bullet proof as they say, the price tag isn't high at all, considering what the half dozen MMs, two Quarks and four Compros cost looking for the "right" controller.

Is it difficult to get the Power Jazz to work properly with a Pistal radio.
I always run with mech brakes so forward only is fine for me and I may have to give this esc a try if progamming for a pistal is easy and dependable.

I heard from that the boat guys from rumrunnerracing.com, that it does work with pistol radio. Same with the Jeti/Hacker Spin controllers, they also work with a pistol radio.

Who said that? I've heard the opposite from Kontronik...

FWIW, I run a Jazz 40-6-18 on 4S in a 1:10 buggy. They work great, and the latest version 8 firmware has fixed one bug I used to experience, and improved the braking/reverse algorithm since version 7.

My BJ4WE has the Jazz setup right now. I was running it in my old RC10 when I posted some results of it. The beauty of the low voltage Jazzes is that they have a builtin switching BEC.

Well I've got a 1:8 conversion in the works, but haven't finished it yet. It's been months since I started it! Hopefully I'll get it finished soon so that I can post my experiences. I plan to run a Jazz 55-10-32 and a Neu 1912/1Y on 10S Lipo in it.

Some guy in germany had troubles with a jazz 80-6-18 and Plettenberg Maxximum in a Emaxx. When going from full throttle to say half throttle the motor followed immediately his command: for him it was like braking. While jumping it was troublesome (now he uses a Schulze and does not experience the same behavior).

So he called kontroniks support and their answer was that he was the only one experiencing this behavior and ultimately he should have been using a Jazz car and that they do not recommend other Jazz controllers for car use.

That is the story behind it!!!

Your future 1:8 setup sounds interesting. The Jazz 55-10-32 is a powerfull ESC and is used in helis at up to 4KW (10s and 120A). The 1912 should run very cool. Don't forget to post pictures and comments on this setup. Sounds very promising. Good Luck with your future conversion.

Thanks. I hope to finish the 1:8 soon now. Maybe in the next month. Will update my thread here when its done, but you can see some of it in my RCG blog entry here for the time being.

My brief conversation with Kontronik on my proposed setup seemed good. Can read it here.

Judging from your thread you put a lot more effort in your conversion than i did:lol: Nice motor mount btw

I used a emaxx motor mount, dremeled it the way i needed it and bolted it to the front diff mount. My old buggy already had a plastic spur. I think i used the same material to make my battery trays and wrapped it with Gaffa tape for more stability.

Seeing 2 battery trays and the fact that you turned your center diff to the front i would assume you are going for the following setup

http://www.braintrust.at/2007/ds/rc/buggy_layout.jpg

right?

pretty much what i did too ...

This is a pic of my old 4s setup (Jazz 80-6-18, Fun 600/25 and Konion 4s4p)
And this is how i run it now (Jazz 55-10-32, Neu 1512/2y, 10s1p A123)