Dead 13.5T SSPro

[E-Revonut]

I bought a 13.5T SSPro to run in my SC10 for racing. AE recomends 75/26 gearing for the 13.5. I started with 75/25 gearing, my temps have been between 155-158, so I never geared it any higher. Guys are blowing by me on the track, I can't even clear the little double. There is no binding in the drivetrain, this thing rolls super smooth. I ran 2 weeks with this motor, first week I did pretty good, got the bump up to the A main and finshed 4th. This week I qualified better and made it into the A on the qualifying but the truck was super slow and I finished 9th, coming off the track I got hung up on the pipe and tried giving it some throttle then all the sudden the motor stopped. I quickly unplugged everything. Motor is fried, esc works with another motor. Why was this motor so much slower than everyone else and still coming off the track so warm. Will this be warrantied or is it my fault? I need to buy another motor either way as I know I won't get this one back soon enough for the next race. Is the ballistic that much better? I may have to try something else

[Chadworkz]

Have you taken the motor apart to see what exactly is wrong with it?

[E-Revonut]

I did take the front endbell off and pull the rotor. Rotor isn't demagged and I didn't see anything obvious. But it def smells burnt. Went to the lhs and they marked down a ballistic to within $2 of what I could order one for so I'm gonna give that a try

[Chadworkz]

Hmmm...I am pretty good at diagnosing and fixing electronics, so if you want, you could send the motor to me and I could see if I can figure out what is wrong with it, and either fix it or tell you what's needed to fix it, and then send it back to you (fixed or with instructions on how to fix it). If it needs replacement parts, I could buy them, fix the motor, and then just have you repay me once I finish...or, like I said already, I could send the motor back to you with a lost of the replacement parts it needs and instructions on how to fix it.

[E-Revonut]

Thanks for the offer but the motor is only a month old so I'm gonna send it back to Novak.

[NovakTwo]

Originally Posted by E-Revonut

Thanks for the offer but the motor is only a month old so I'm gonna send it back to Novak.

We offer a fixed price replacement for burnt motors---our warranty does not cover burnt stators.

You could also upgrade to a Ballistic motor. Here is our non-warranty Trade in program:

TeamNovak BL Motor Trade-In Program

The problem with overheating your motor to the point of melting the wire insulation (shorting the stator wires together) is the real overheating cannot be measured after you complete your run---it is caused by intermittent blasts of excessive current.

[Arct1k]

Novak - I thought you had built in thermal protection on Motors?

[Arct1k]

You do!!!

"Novak's award-winning SS Pro Brushless Motors offer a world-class spec-racing experience. Each SS Pro motor is equipped with a nickel-plated sintered Neodymium rotor for maximum motor acceleration, braking power and performance in high-temperature conditions, and Thermal Overload technology to ensure the motor is operating at a safe temperature. The SS Pro motors also feature a shielded-sensor cable and a completely rebuildable design, allowing for the ability to upgrade or replace various motor parts. In addition, each motor is identified by a color-specific timing ring for simple differentiation between spec motors: 8.5 – black, 10.5 – blue, 13.5 – orange, 17.5 – yellow and 21.5 – green."

So how can a user get the motor hot enough to melt the insulation yet not de-mag the rotor... Its a bit cheaky to advertise thermal protection and then not warranty it!

[NovakTwo]

Originally Posted by Arct1k

Novak - I thought you had built in thermal protection on Motors?

Thermal overload protection is active only when using the motor with a Novak controller designed with the TOP sensor activated---Havoc 1S, 2S, 3S, etc. We removed the TOP from our GTBs (for example) years ago, because racers did not want their systems to stop because the motor was overheating.

Our racing escs have not included this circuitry for years. The blue sensor wire senses the motor temp, but the circuitry must be built-into both components for it to work.

Dynamic timing escs have created a horrible issue with burning up stators; this was an important reason why we designed the Ballistics to be completely rebuildable; racers can replace their stators and weakened magnets without returning the motors for service.

We added this Motor Warning(PDF / sixth on list) to our web site front page a couple of years ago:

Technical Updates

Our upcoming Havoc Pro SC, with 8 levels of built-in timing, features circuitry that will turn off the timing when the controller starts to overheat; this allows the racer to complete the race with no timing, but protects the esc from damage.

[Arct1k]

Thansk I'm not sure what ESC he was using but suspect it was a MMP.

As you may recall I did have the same issue occur on a goat 2s platform with the crawler 18.5T - I would have expected the protection to kick in before the stator melted.

[NovakTwo]

Originally Posted by Arct1k

Thansk I'm not sure what ESC he was using but suspect it was a MMP.

As you may recall I did have the same issue occur on a goat 2s platform with the crawler 18.5T - I would have expected the protection to kick in before the stator melted.

Our BL Crawler systems are similar but the blue sensor wire is enabled differently; The Goat esc must sense a Novak BL Crawler motor attached to enable the crawler specific (not, TOP) circuitry. If you use a different mfg's motor, the crawler-specific program is not enabled. If the esc does not detect a Novak CR motor, the esc reverts to standard Havoc (not Crawler) performance.

I do not know that any other mfg enables the blue sensor wire (for anything)---and, believe me, many customers don't like it a bit. They believe their options are being limited. Maybe they are; however, with the low-cost Havoc Spec systems, we didn't want beginners burning up their electronics and returning them for "free" replacements. If you damage the motor stator, or weaken the magnet, you can pull enough current thru the esc to melt it down.

[Arct1k]

Is there any way of "telling" if the ESC recognizes it is joined with a Novak motor and hence protection is enabled.

I don't want to run into the same issue again...

[NovakTwo]

Originally Posted by Arct1k

Is there any way of "telling" if the ESC recognizes it is joined with a Novak motor and hence protection is enabled.

I don't want to run into the same issue again...

Our copy will explain that only Novak motors will run with certain Novak escs. As I said, only the Havocs (listed above) currently have fixed, TOP sensors enabled. In the early GTB days, racers either cut, or unplugged the blue wires to circumvent the TOP.

However, disabling the blue wire in these Havocs will prevent them from running at all....Live and learn.

[Arct1k]

Sorry I'm confused are you saying a Novak Goat 2s ESC / Novak 18.5T crawler Combo system does not have thermal protection?

http://www.teamnovak.com/products/es...oat/index.html

This seems to say in the specs that the Goat 2S includes "Thermal Overload Protection and Novak’s Radio-Priority Circuitry™ "

[E-Revonut]

I was using a mmpro as arct1k assumed. I bought a ballistic 13.5 to try now, Novaks last chance with me. I will prolly trade in my burnt 13.5 for a 17.5 for the winter indoor season.