New Neu HV Revo setup nearly complete, w/ data, pix and vids - RC-Monster Forums

Finnster

I am finishing up on my HV Revo setup and thought I'd post some of my results after I've got most of the bugs worked out and had some time to do some good testing. In short, it kicks asssssssss.

I've replaced my MM/8XL setup with a high-voltage, hi-efficiency powerplant. I am now running a MGM 9032 ESC and a Neu 1515/2y/F (1100kv) driven by 33V 10S A123s or 8S Lipos. Geared 16/36 on std 2nd gear. Top speed is geared for low 40s (~42 mph on radar.) I have room to gear up still, but this is plenty fast.

Basically the aim was to be able to keep the A123 cells and go to a hi-eff setup, and not have to up in cell count. In short, any setup that draws more than 70A really needs to have a 2P config to not overly draw the cells. That leaves 10S1P or 5s2p like I had. Going the HV route, I am able to run the cells I want, but also run @ higher eff which translates to more power to the ground, less wasted heat, and a very smooth and powerful system.

The old system drew nearly 120A @14V to make ~1650W. However, the XL setup was only maybe 70-75% eff. Meaning less than 1250W made it to the wheels, while 100s of watts were lost as heat. It was easy to overheat motor w/o careful driving.

Now I make 1650W with 61A peak @ 27V+. At ~95% eff, that translates to nearly 1570W to the ground and only 80W lost as heat.

===> Extremely powerful and cool running system. The motor never gets very warm. The esc is dead cold.

Here is a torture test. I dumped the full pack in less than 8min. (Normally I get ~20+min bashing.) WOT thru long wet grass up and down a hill non-stop. Doing this w/ my XL system would over heat the system fast. I'd see 180-190F on the motor in minutes. Here, final temp is only 112F. The ESC was 85F at the end. Ambient temp was 65F.

Even at that the temps only spiked at the end trying to drive on the dumped pack. Mostly stayed ~100F. This has been a dream system so far. :)

Overall I really like the MGM. It had a bit of a learning curve compared to the MM, but its an awesome controller. Very nicely built and very smooth on the throttle. One thing I also did that is not shown here is I put the two speed back into the tranny. The MGM can't spin the motor quite as slow as the MM, and along with the much lower gearing, the slowest speed is a bit fast. Kinda like the old EVX in the emaxx. Now w/ a low 1st gear I have more decent crawling speeds. Plus the auto-shifting is very cool. Just have to nice w/ the trigger, but that's true w/ any BL.

Here's a few setup pics. Not a whole lot has changed from before. The Esc is long, so some care was taken to place it right and protect those huge caps. I re-did the batt straps to be easier and much stronger. The RCM Bash was tearing up my old ones w/ all those roof landings, lol. So far I'm very pleased. I've also mounted a RC8 wing on a mugen MBX5T stay which isn't shown.

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10.29.2007, 04:04 PM

Very nice Finnster. i must get one of these e-revo thingies.

lutach · 10.29.2007, 04:24 PM

Awesome. Got to love HV. Hopefully tomorrow I'll run my BPP truck with 10S lipos and I'll post some data on that run. I would love to post it here if you don't mind. The only problem is that I'll be spinning my Neu at close to 58K rpms and I thought about going with my 1521/1.5y, but I'll see if the 1521/1y can withstand some abuse.

Dafni · 10.29.2007, 04:30 PM

Nice, Finny.

I still have a 1950 with similar KV around... maybe I should try an MGM after all.

tallyram · 10.29.2007, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dafni

Nice, Finny.

I still have a 1950 with similar KV around... maybe I should try an MGM after all.

i am really impressed with mine!

othello · 10.29.2007, 09:10 PM

Very "cool" HV setup. Thanx for sharing all your data. Wow ... i never managed to discharge my 10s A123 pack in under 10 minutes. Grass is definitively the best torture you can put your setup through. 1700 Watt is the maximum i saw with my Buggy too. What does your Revo wheigh fully loaded?

Reason i ask is: i just finished my 3rd conversion and moved all my HV stuff (Jazz 55+Neu1512/2Y+10s1p A123) from my buggy in a truggy which now wheighs 10.8lbs (4,9Kg). I think your data should be pretty close to what i will see (after fitting a hardened steel pinion) since i geared her for 40mph.

I hope you don't mind when i post some pics and data here too. I maidened her today on concrete but was short of a hardened steel pinion so i took it very easy with a non hardened one which survived only for 4 minutes: pic of my setup, Eagletree graph, video with my broken video cam

starscream · 10.29.2007, 10:11 PM

I'm getting about the same temps but I'm using the CC HV110 and a 1515/2y/extra thin can and 10SA123.
I ran my G2R with 10SA123 on Saturday on a 1/10th scale track and the packs didn't dump until 28 minutes into the run.

Finnster · 10.30.2007, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by othello

Very "cool" HV setup. Thanx for sharing all your data. Wow ... i never managed to discharge my 10s A123 pack in under 10 minutes. Grass is definitively the best torture you can put your setup through. 1700 Watt is the maximum i saw with my Buggy too. What does your Revo wheigh fully loaded?

Reason i ask is: i just finished my 3rd conversion and moved all my HV stuff (Jazz 55+Neu1512/2Y+10s1p A123) from my buggy in a truggy which now wheighs 10.8lbs (4,9Kg). I think your data should be pretty close to what i will see (after fitting a hardened steel pinion) since i geared her for 40mph.

I hope you don't mind when i post some pics and data here too. I maidened her today on concrete but was short of a hardened steel pinion so i took it very easy with a non hardened one which survived only for 4 minutes: pic of my setup, Eagletree graph, video with my broken video cam

Well I weighed again yesterday and it was a portly 4.5kg w/o the batts, so I think w/ 10cells its ~5.2kg.

However, this is with those beadlock mounted maxx mashers (also taped) which are extremely heavy, and the above mentioned wing. In race trim it was weighing 3.9kg w/o batt and w/o wing on the old MM/XL setup. The dishes/CF tires are so much lighter, but the mashers are my all-around basher tire which I love. They go anywhere and are still wearing well for over a year of use.

There is one last race event @ barnstormers this year, so I'll try to get a weight when its prepped. I hope to get ~4.5-4.7kg RTR then.

Oh, and by all means post any data. I've seen some of it before, and I really like your ET-linked vids. I'm always curious to see more data.

I did assemble a little 2S A123 pack. I'm going to try and run that tied in for 12S just to see what happens. It should break 50 if I can control it. Purely for research purposes however.

sleebus.jones · 10.30.2007, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by starscream

I ran my G2R with 10SA123 on Saturday on a 1/10th scale track and the packs didn't dump until 28 minutes into the run.

Wow, really? I wouldn't think that 2300mAh would take you that far, but good efficiency I guess, huh? Hm. This really makes me rethink things now....

Finnster · 10.30.2007, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sleebus.jones

Wow, really? I wouldn't think that 2300mAh would take you that far, but good efficiency I guess, huh? Hm. This really makes me rethink things now....

Keep in mind tho that a 10S pack @2.3Ah= 5s2p pack @4.6Ah (and 5S ~=4S lipo.)

It doesn't seem like its that much, but the amp draw is less than half than a "std" 4s setup so it lasts a while. Gets a bit wierd to think about, but the total energy is the same.

Finnster · 05:10 PM

Ok so tried to run 12S A123 over lunch (hehe),,, Ran great :)

Best top spd I could get was 47 mph on radar. This is not to say it was all it had, just kept running out of room. If I accel'd harder it would just wheelie, even @35mph+

It basically ran like the 5S video I have linked in my sig. Even at that, this is my V2.0 3.3 chassis-based Revo that I took special considerations to limit wheelies over my v1.0 2.5r-based Revo that was a wheelie monster. Up till now the V2.0 has been wheelie resistant.

Also, I was topping out @ 48mph on stock talons w/ v1.0 on 5S. Today I was running the above mentioned mashers which are sooo much heavier, and had plenty of throttle left I couldn't apply. I have no doubt this could sail past 50 if i had the tires and space to do it. I may have to make this a goal just for fun. Even on 5S on the XL setup, I could only do 44mph w/ the mashers on. The neu is really showing its stuff.

I gave up on the 12S and went down to 10S again and set a new spd record for me @ 45mph w/ the mashers. HAHA this is so freaking cool.

After that I just talked to some guys in the park who were watching me. Basically they were "holy $!#% that thing is fast!" One guy said he had an elec pan car back in the day but gave it up due to the PITA batts and brushes. He said my truck would have killed his little thing. I told him about brushless and lithiums and all the stuff going on today. "I'll have to go home and dig my car out"

othello · 10.30.2007, 08:15 PM

Great to hear that your setup even handles 12s A123. Your 1515 (1100kv) should hit around 40000rpm at this voltage (36-37V under load at full speed on concrete). Did you check your motor temperature after this run? Do you have some eagletree data of this run? I do not wonder that there is more speed potential in your HV setup. Besides ballooning of your tires and handling i think the next limiting factor would be the 1p configuration of your A123, then your ESC and only then your motor. But who needs 45mph anyway. It's a good feeling though that your setup can manage it without any issues. Others probably would have dealt with heat issues when trying to do this on 4 or 5s.

I would have loved to get a motor with a KV of around 1100. But the lowest Neu 1512 has a KV of 1400. This is why i saw rpm spikes between 42000-44000rpm in my buggy. Even if the Neu 1512 seems to do well at those rpm levels i think it would even run cooler when staying below 40000 rpm (but i don't want to run it on 8 or 9s A123 cells). I also had the impression that the motor feels torquier between 0 to 3/4 of its rpm range and then it becomes less and less (which would correspond to the typical torque curve of an electric motor). But i guess this is quite normal as air drag becomes more and more an issue at higher speeds, thus slowing down your acceleration more and more.

As soon as i have sorted out my pinion problem i will post some data and a new video with ET Data of my new truggy.

lutach · 10.30.2007, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by othello

Great to hear that your setup even handles 12s A123. Your 1515 (1100kv) should hit around 40000rpm at this voltage (36-37V under load at full speed on concrete). Did you check your motor temperature after this run? Do you have some eagletree data of this run? I do not wonder that there is more speed potential in your HV setup. Besides ballooning of your tires and handling i think the next limiting factor would be the 1p configuration of your A123, then your ESC and only then your motor. But who needs 45mph anyway. It's a good feeling though that your setup can manage it without any issues. Others probably would have dealt with heat issues when trying to do this on 4 or 5s.

I would have loved to get a motor with a KV of around 1100. But the lowest Neu 1512 has a KV of 1400. This is why i saw rpm spikes between 42000-44000rpm in my buggy. Even if the Neu 1512 seems to do well at those rpm levels i think it would even run cooler when staying below 40000 rpm (but i don't want to run it on 8 or 9s A123 cells). I also had the impression that the motor feels torquier between 0 to 3/4 of its rpm range and then it becomes less and less (which would correspond to the typical torque curve of an electric motor). But i guess this is quite normal as air drag becomes more and more an issue at higher speeds, thus slowing down your acceleration more and more.

As soon as i have sorted out my pinion problem i will post some data and a new video with ET Data of my new truggy.

I ran my BPP truck with 10S lipo today and it hauls. I was going to bolt my 1521/1.5Y, but the 1521/1Y is already in the truck. I will stick with a 6S lipo for now.

othello · 10.30.2007, 09:20 PM

Neu 1521/1Y (1577KV) @35-40V equals 55000-63000rpm

That is absolutely on the edge of its 60000 RPM limit. And i did worry about 40000-45000rpm ... feeling stupid right now.

So now you know how your motor operates at its limit.

lutach · 10.30.2007, 10:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by othello

Neu 1521/1Y (1577KV) @35-40V equals 55000-63000rpm

That is absolutely on the edge of its 60000 RPM limit. And i did worry about 40000-45000rpm ... feeling stupid right now.

So now you know how your motor operates at its limit.

It is definitely a good feeling to know it can take it. I'm going to get some special batteries that will make my 1521/1.5Y and 1527/1.5Y do amazing things. All I can say is I'll be able to use 14S of this cells in the BPP truck, but I can go as high as 18S.