New castle 1515 sensored electrical spec

[maxxximatoze]

Hi all,

What is the electrical parameters of this new motor (I0 and rm). Does anyone have the opportunity to measure these parameters ?

[Pdelcast]

Originally Posted by maxxximatoze

Hi all,

What is the electrical parameters of this new motor (I0 and rm). Does anyone have the opportunity to measure these parameters ?

RM: .005 ohms (5 milliohms)
IO: 2.7A (out of the box, before run-in)

Thanks!

[maxxximatoze]

Thanks Patrick for the answer.

I suppose that I0 is for 10V ?

[maxxximatoze]

So the iron losses for 16V should be around 54W, am I right ? I have a Hpi Alphastar 2350KV (If I'm remenber well, is a 1517 1Y with N28UH magnets and 0.35 lamination for cost killing which is, in fact, 2480KV@no load) that is burning 70W in iron losses at 16V, how many degrees difference between the two ?

It is controlled by a mamba max pro with 1.52 firmware, so the sensored mode attract me a lot ! Thx !

[Pdelcast]

Originally Posted by maxxximatoze

So the iron losses for 16V should be around 54W, am I right ? I have a Hpi Alphastar 2350KV (If I'm remenber well, is a 1517 1Y with N28UH magnets and 0.35 lamination for cost killing which is, in fact, 2480KV@no load) that is burning 70W in iron losses at 16V, how many degrees difference between the two ?

It is controlled by a mamba max pro with 1.52 firmware, so the sensored mode attract me a lot ! Thx !

We are using a .2mm lamination, special High Frequency grade, Japanese steel. So the iron losses are quite low.

I think you should see about 1/2 the iron losses with our motor, vs a motor with standard .35mm laminations. In our motor, the iron losses are the minority losses -- more important is the copper losses. At 5 milliohms, the iron losses are about 50 watts at 100A.

Thanks!

[maxxximatoze]

Originally Posted by Pdelcast

We are using a .2mm lamination, special High Frequency grade, Japanese steel. So the iron losses are quite low.

I think you should see about 1/2 the iron losses with our motor, vs a motor with standard .35mm laminations. In our motor, the iron losses are the minority losses -- more important is the copper losses. At 5 milliohms, the iron losses are about 50 watts at 100A.

Thanks!

This new motor is really efficient ! the hpi 2350kv (also made by castle for hpi but low cost) is more than 5A at 24V no load (125W of heat...), almost twice the current of the new castle 2200kv sensored at the same voltage ! Not bad at all. My current motor need a big fan (delta 40*28mm FFB0412VHN 15.79CFM 1400LFM) to stay cool for long time run (offroad track with turnigy graphene 4S 10000mah, 30 to 40 min run time with 18 pinion 48 spur), I think that with the castle, no need for a fan.

Raaahhh I think I need to spend some money...

[Pdelcast]

Originally Posted by maxxximatoze

Thanks Patrick for the answer.

I suppose that I0 is for 10V ?

That's measured at 24V. I can get you a 10V measurement if you want, we test the 6S motors at 24V.

[Kcaz25]

let us know

[maxxximatoze]

For those who are interested (if any) in electrical parameters from this new motor, I've done some meseaures on my brand new 1515 1Y sensored (bought from amain, hope that it's not a fake !)

The motor is on my desk with no cooling and no pinion, and it is new. The esc is a brand new castle MMX (also from amain). These measures where done from a regulated power supply to get precise input voltage, current and wattage (dps3005 verified by myself for its precision readings) and a little oscilloscope to get the precise wave form on motor phases (to check the full throttle) and the precise frenquency to determine the rpm (freq/2x60 because of 2 poles pairs). The I0 is the current from the PSU minus the idle current consume by the esc (which is variyng between 150mA@8V to 75mA@24V). The motor power loss is then the PSU voltage by the motor I0. I don't use MMX logging to get I0 current because it not precise enough on such low current.


At 8V I0=2A power=16W rpm=17760 and kv=2220 (maxeff=93.1% at 56.6A)
At 10V I0=2.2A power=22W rpm=22140 and kv=2214 (maxeff=93.5% at 66.3A)
At 12V I0=2.4A power=29W rpm=26640 and kv=2220 (maxeff=93.8% at 75.9A)
At 16V I0=3.0A power=48W rpm=35460 and kv=2216 (maxeff=94.0% at 98.0A)
At 24V I0=4.0A power=96W rpm=53250 and kv=2219 (maxeff=94.3% at 138.6A)

I will do the measure at 20V soon.

The MMX logging of RPM is 3.6-3.7% more than my measures. Not too bad. Maybe due to it's clock without crystal oscillator. Dont' really know.

The motor heats up very slowly at 8V (takes several minutes to reach 50°C) but it's a different story at 24V, it's more a matter of seconds before it reach 50°C and before you can't hold it in your hand. And it is with no work done, just the losses. It's always a good idea to have a good cooling solution.

The next step is to mesaure precisly the Rm of each phase to see if the motor is well around 5 milliohms.

Question for patrick, are you sure your measure was at 24V ? Because your result seems very far from what I get (2.7A versus 4.0A).

[Pdelcast]

Originally Posted by maxxximatoze

For those who are interested (if any) in electrical parameters from this new motor, I've done some meseaures on my brand new 1515 1Y sensored (bought from amain, hope that it's not a fake !)

The motor is on my desk with no cooling and no pinion, and it is new. The esc is a brand new castle MMX (also from amain). These measures where done from a regulated power supply to get precise input voltage, current and wattage (dps3005 verified by myself for its precision readings) and a little oscilloscope to get the precise wave form on motor phases (to check the full throttle) and the precise frenquency to determine the rpm (freq/2x60 because of 2 poles pairs). The I0 is the current from the PSU minus the idle current consume by the esc (which is variyng between 150mA@8V to 75mA@24V). The motor power loss is then the PSU voltage by the motor I0. I don't use MMX logging to get I0 current because it not precise enough on such low current.


At 8V I0=2A power=16W rpm=17760 and kv=2220 (maxeff=93.1% at 56.6A)
At 10V I0=2.2A power=22W rpm=22140 and kv=2214 (maxeff=93.5% at 66.3A)
At 12V I0=2.4A power=29W rpm=26640 and kv=2220 (maxeff=93.8% at 75.9A)
At 16V I0=3.0A power=48W rpm=35460 and kv=2216 (maxeff=94.0% at 98.0A)
At 24V I0=4.0A power=96W rpm=53250 and kv=2219 (maxeff=94.3% at 138.6A)

I will do the measure at 20V soon.

The MMX logging of RPM is 3.6-3.7% more than my measures. Not too bad. Maybe due to it's clock without crystal oscillator. Dont' really know.

The motor heats up very slowly at 8V (takes several minutes to reach 50°C) but it's a different story at 24V, it's more a matter of seconds before it reach 50°C and before you can't hold it in your hand. And it is with no work done, just the losses. It's always a good idea to have a good cooling solution.

The next step is to mesaure precisly the Rm of each phase to see if the motor is well around 5 milliohms.

Question for patrick, are you sure your measure was at 24V ? Because your result seems very far from what I get (2.7A versus 4.0A).

Were you running sensored or sensorless? What phase advance were you using?

Note that you will see higher IO at higher phase advance.

Thanks!

Patrick

[maxxximatoze]

Originally Posted by Pdelcast

Were you running sensored or sensorless? What phase advance were you using?

Note that you will see higher IO at higher phase advance.

Thanks!

Patrick

Thx for the answer. It was sensorless. I have tested both mode and no real differences between the two. The advance is set to low (0 to 5 if I remember well) with castle link.

[maxxximatoze]

And now here is the Rm for each phase (measured with precisely 5A passing through the phase and a millivolt meter on the motor solders)

AB=5.6 mohms
AC=5.6 mohms
BC=4.4 mohms

It's weird that there is so much difference between two phases, no ?

average of the three 5.2 mohms

[Pdelcast]

Originally Posted by maxxximatoze

Thx for the answer. It was sensorless. I have tested both mode and no real differences between the two. The advance is set to low (0 to 5 if I remember well) with castle link.

Not surprising you didn't see a difference -- even in sensored mode, timing above a certain threshold is dominated by the sensorless routine. (which makes sense...)

You are probably close to the maximum 5 degree advance at 24V, so your rise in current is normal.

Thanks!

Patrick