House repairs...

[JThiessen]

Originally Posted by JERRY2KONE

That is exactly the point that I am trying to make. Yea I know we are all looking for ways to save a few bucks and cut down on overspending, but when it comes to your home there are just some things that have to be done the hard way. Just hearing some of the points of view on this subject should really make you think closely before jumping into using a cement saw, or jackhammer. The thought of your foundation shifting, or having even more water come into your basement would scare the hell out of me. Like I stated earlier a few beers can go a long way in getting good advice.

Eh - why let fear and common sense stand in the way of a good DIY home repair story.....

I've never learned anything by doing it right the first time!

[JERRY2KONE]

We all have to know what our limits are. Ripping up carpeting is hard work but relaitvely easy to do from the thinking standpoint. Laying carpet is hard work as well, but you can hardly hurt your home if it is not installed correctly. Putting in a window or hanging a door can save you money, but will not make your house fall down if you do it wrong, so go for it.

BUT spraying sealant over a wet basement hoping that it will hold back the water is a waste of time & money, and surely punching holes in your basement floor can cause damage to the foundation of your home if you have flowing water under it. There are just some things that one should not do DIY if they have no experience in that field. One should weigh the possible outcome against the possible savings when trying to avoid spending too much money. How many times have we seen someone trying to skimp on a job and ending up with a catastrophy as a result due to a pure and simple lack of knowledge, which ended up costing them $$$$$$ to recover? We are all allowed our opinions, and we are all suceptable to our own stupidity or lack of understanding sometimes. That is why the voice of reason is always out there for us to hear. BOTTOM LINE you have to make your own decisions and be ready to accept the consiquences of our actions. Good luck BG.

[pinkpanda3310]

I wasn't implying to jump in and do it on advice from a forum rather getting you to think about other options to regular pumping out. There are products that will seal in the wet even if it leaks from the other side. Speedliner probably isn't sound advice, it was just the first to spring to mind.

I'm sure Brian has his head screwed on and the outcome will be better than the current situation. On the other hand if the basement is constantly below the water line and has'nt been engineered to suit it might be opening a can of worms.

[Maxx42]

Originally Posted by JERRY2KONE

BUT spraying sealant over a wet basement hoping that it will hold back the water is a waste of time & money, and surely punching holes in your basement floor can cause damage to the foundation of your home if you have flowing water under it. There are just some things that one should not do DIY if they have no experience in that field. One should weigh the possible outcome against the possible savings when trying to avoid spending too much money. How many times have we seen someone trying to skimp on a job and ending up with a catastrophy as a result due to a pure and simple lack of knowledge, which ended up costing them $$$$$$ to recover? We are all allowed our opinions, and we are all suceptable to our own stupidity or lack of understanding sometimes. That is why the voice of reason is always out there for us to hear. BOTTOM LINE you have to make your own decisions and be ready to accept the consiquences of our actions. Good luck BG.

Spraying sealant on wet concrete is a horrible idea because the sealant would never be able to cure properly. Any type of sealant should be applied during dry conditions. The point that I was trying to make before was that there are other options that should be explored that are DIY before doing something more radical like chopping up the foundation floor for a well for a sump pump (which still doesn't solve the problem of the water entering the basement, it just provides a way to get rid of it). Also as far as some contractors go - he could talk to a "professional" that may say "you could do that, but in the end you'll really need this". I personally would take even their advice with a grain of salt - business is really down for most contractors and many of them are looking for that one job that can carry them for a couple of weeks. Maybe he'll get advice from a contractor that is spot on without the huge pricetag that goes with it, but I doubt it. I do agree with you that in the end BG will have to make up his own mind on what he will do and accept any possible consequences, however with that being said, I hate to see someone spend a pile of money going straight to a contractor without trying simpler and far less expensive alternatives first that in most cases do work (this is coming from someone with 15 plus years in construction - this isn't my field of expertise, but I know how contractors talk and I have picked up quite a few tips in my time).

[BrianG]

Thanks for all the input guys. I fully understand the risks, which is why I sought some other opinions before chopping into the floor. I hesitate to contact a contractor because they are in it to make money and will most likely dishonestly advise whatever will put more of my cash into their pocket. Approaching a contractor I do not know and offering to buy drinks is a good way to make them think I am after more than their professional services.

I do not believe there is "running water" under the floor, or else there would be a LOT more flooding than there is. It's just a matter of a saturated water table. Last year's flood was the worst I have ever seen and even then the floor drain was more than adequate to keep up with the flow coming in. It was never super bad, just enough to cover the low areas of the floor.

I also understand the risks in cutting into the floor. Any hole I create will be at least 4 feet away from any walls to eliminate the chance of compromising the structural integrity of the walls. Yeah, I don't need the basement becoming the first floor.

The sealant would be a good idea if the floor was just prone to "sweating", but flowing water is powerful stuff and it will find a way in no matter what. So, trying to block the water is probably not gonna work. Even pouring another layer of cement would be a temporary fix if that, and all I'd get out of the deal is a lower ceiling. The idea behind the sump pump idea is to 1) drain water under the basement before it can come in (or at least reduce the intensity), and 2) control where the flow comes in.

I'm still doing research, but everything I've read points to the sump pump idea. It's just a matter of how I'm gonna cut the floor, which I think we've covered.

[suck my wake]

You should not be scared with cutting a 12x12 hole in the corner of your basement floor. I should do no harm. All along the outside of the floor where it touches the walls should be expansion joint which for sure is not water proof if there was running water under you floor it sure as well would be flowing out from this joint if anything the joint already has as much open surface area as the hole you would be cutting. My Mothers house is within 10 feet for a small stream. There is a 2 foot hole in the basement with a sump pump in it if it wasnt for that sump pump, every time it rained hard, there would have been inches of water in the basment. As long as you pipe the water a decent amount away from your house that sump pump will do no harm.

[BrianG]

Update:

Sump pump has been successfully installed! What a PAIN IN THE ummm, BUTT! Because of the age and hardness of the concrete, I opted to use a cement saw. Using a jackhammer might have created cracks all over the place. Anyway, the cement saw worked well, but what a mess!!!! I used some plastic to make a little "room" around the work area to help contain the dust and I set a shop vac nearby to help rid the dust, but it was still an insane amount of dust. There were times I couldn't even see the saw I was holding about 1 foot away!

Getting the 2' X 2' X ~4" slab out was hard as well. That thing weighs a ton and I'm not a small guy. Then, when I started digging, I hit water about 12" down. The rest of the ~3' was painstakingly slow because of the dirt/water soup. Even then, the tub doesn't sit all the way down, but far enough to do the job (tested it fine).

Man, if I never have to do this again, it will still be one more time than I want to do it!

[JERRY2KONE]

Originally Posted by BrianG

Update:

Man, if I never have to do this again, it will still be one more time than I want to do it!

Well we are just happy to hear that all is well and that the job is completed. So how is the rest of the project going for you BG?

[BrianG]

Slow. Finished one of the inside doors, and planning to start on the others slowly.

The bathroom remodel will have to wait until I come up with ~$5-7k to have it done right. Electrical/electronics are easy, but I seem to have "trouble" doing anything related to plumbing. In the meantime, I'm gonna start looking up general contractors and lining up some estimates. I just hate spending that kind of money for a place to poop.

[JERRY2KONE]

Originally Posted by BrianG

Slow. Finished one of the inside doors, and planning to start on the others slowly.

The bathroom remodel will have to wait until I come up with ~$5-7k to have it done right. Electrical/electronics are easy, but I seem to have "trouble" doing anything related to plumbing. In the meantime, I'm gonna start looking up general contractors and lining up some estimates. I just hate spending that kind of money for a place to poop.

Yea we feel ya dog. The only problem is that women look at quite differently then we do. I believe that the poopie room is number one on most womens list of importance, next to the kitchen. And of course we have to keep them happy now don't we?

[BrianG]

lol, actually it's my project. It's my house, my g/f moved in about a year ago, so most of these project are things I've been wanting to do. The ex and her brats continually trashed the house so there was no point to fixing stuff and now things are behind and I have little motivation. But my g/f is "persuasive" when she "suggests" things to be done.

[JThiessen]

Originally Posted by BrianG

Update:

Sump pump has been successfully installed! What a PAIN IN THE ummm, BUTT! Because of the age and hardness of the concrete, I opted to use a cement saw. Using a jackhammer might have created cracks all over the place. Anyway, the cement saw worked well, but what a mess!!!! I used some plastic to make a little "room" around the work area to help contain the dust and I set a shop vac nearby to help rid the dust, but it was still an insane amount of dust. There were times I couldn't even see the saw I was holding about 1 foot away!

Getting the 2' X 2' X ~4" slab out was hard as well. That thing weighs a ton and I'm not a small guy. Then, when I started digging, I hit water about 12" down. The rest of the ~3' was painstakingly slow because of the dirt/water soup. Even then, the tub doesn't sit all the way down, but far enough to do the job (tested it fine).

Man, if I never have to do this again, it will still be one more time than I want to do it!

#1) I haven't looked at concrete saws in quite some time, but shouldnt you have been using water with that saw? All the concrete saws I've run had a hose attachment on it. Saves those diamond coated saw blades. When I was in college, I got a cutting concrete on a highway crew. First morning I burned up 3 of those 36" dia blades. Boss about had a cow - they ran about 600 bucks each back then!

#2) Why didn't you cut that block up - or at least break it up with a sledge...

Glad you got it done - you'll sleep a bit better next time the rains come.

[BrianG]

I specifically asked the rental place about water on the blade and they said just a little to help keep dust down, but not to use too much because it's an electrical saw (duh). Well, I sprayed the area and it didn't help with the dust, and wanted to follow their instructions so they don't try to bill me for the blade.

Even if I had one, I don't think I could have boken it with a sledge. This concrete is ~30 years old, well cured, and ~4" thick. Besides, the chips flying everywhere would probably be dangerous. I preferred the brute force approach and carry it up the stairs. :)

[E-Revonut]

Originally Posted by JThiessen

#1) I haven't looked at concrete saws in quite some time, but shouldnt you have been using water with that saw? All the concrete saws I've run had a hose attachment on it. Saves those diamond coated saw blades. When I was in college, I got a cutting concrete on a highway crew. First morning I burned up 3 of those 36" dia blades. Boss about had a cow - they ran about 600 bucks each back then!

#2) Why didn't you cut that block up - or at least break it up with a sledge...

Glad you got it done - you'll sleep a bit better next time the rains come.

I agree, electric or not sawing through concrete generally requires water. Not a full on bath but diamond blades get hot and the water keeps them cool as well as keeping the dust down.

[JThiessen]

Originally Posted by BrianG

Even if I had one, I don't think I could have boken it with a sledge. This concrete is ~30 years old, well cured, and ~4" thick. Besides, the chips flying everywhere would probably be dangerous. I preferred the brute force approach and carry it up the stairs. :)

I think you'd of been suprised how easy it would break using a small sledge and a concrete chisle.
I suspect your young blood wanted the challenge of showing off!