If I was the owner, what would I do?

[lutach]

Originally Posted by Five-oh-joe

Doesn't castle have a stake in military stuff somewhat? I coulda swore they built some heavy duty controllers for military electric motor applications or something. Maybe I'm thinking Medusa though.

Anyways, if I owned CC, I would take an approach not unlike azjc's. Becoming the Traxxas of the ESC industry would mean tons of money, and more money means more potential to expand into other ventures. So once the company because something of that caliber, I would expand into Electric Vehicle controllers (1:1) and induction motors (1:1). I'd also continue to keep producing new and great stuff for RC cars, boats, and planes, and also possibly venture into some battery technology if possible.

You might be thinking of Aveox. Now would be a great time for them to make a comeback. I think Castle had more sales then Traxxas did in 2007 so they aren't as small as we think. New and great stuff is what I'm looking for. Great ideas.

[Pdelcast]

Originally Posted by lutach

You might be thinking of Aveox. Now would be a great time for them to make a comeback. I think Castle had more sales then Traxxas did in 2007 so they aren't as small as we think. New and great stuff is what I'm looking for. Great ideas.

I don't know if we had more sales than Traxxas -- just don't know how much Traxxas did.

Between our Industrial, Hobby, and Military controllers we build between 20,000 and 30,000 controllers a month. Hobby is about 85% of our business (but industrial and military are growing.)

My biggest issue is getting time to work on hobby controllers and projects -- too much other stuff always taking my time...

[lutach]

Originally Posted by Pdelcast

I don't know if we had more sales than Traxxas -- just don't know how much Traxxas did.

Between our Industrial, Hobby, and Military controllers we build between 20,000 and 30,000 controllers a month. Hobby is about 85% of our business (but industrial and military are growing.)

My biggest issue is getting time to work on hobby controllers and projects -- too much other stuff always taking my time...

Traxxas had $3.5mil in sales for 2007 and Castle had $7mil. and that not bad at all. I know how it is. I'm not making much money now because my time is mostly for my daughter. I just started this to geather ideas and see what people would do. It's been a dream of my, but I'm not an engineer so I'll keep dreaming. Your company sure beats the hell out of Schulze when it comes to service and customer support.

[Pdelcast]

Originally Posted by lutach

Traxxas had $3.5mil in sales for 2007 and Castle had $7mil. and that not bad at all.

Hmmmmm... how do you know that?

[lutach]

Originally Posted by Pdelcast

Hmmmmm... how do you know that?

I was a stock broker and I learned a few things here and there about getting some info. Sometimes they are not accurate, but they are close.

[Pdelcast]

Originally Posted by lutach

I was a stock broker and I learned a few things here and there about getting some info. Sometimes they are not accurate, but they are close.

Yeah, that number is low -- but not that far off. . .

[Pdelcast]

Also, pretty much everyone reuses PCBs. The power board that was originally designed for the Phoenix-80 is also used for the Phoenix-60, Phx-125, Phx-180, Phx-45HV, Phx-85HV, Phx-110HV, Phx-160HV, Hydra-120, 240, 60HV, 120HV, 180HV, 240HV, etc.

That board is a 6oz / layer, 6 layer board -- for approx .060" copper -- VERY EXPENSIVE circuit board. The next heaviest board I've seen in the industry uses 3oz copper, eight layers -- 24oz vrs 36oz for our power board.

[lutach]

Originally Posted by Pdelcast

Also, pretty much everyone reuses PCBs. The power board that was originally designed for the Phoenix-80 is also used for the Phoenix-60, Phx-125, Phx-180, Phx-45HV, Phx-85HV, Phx-110HV, Phx-160HV, Hydra-120, 240, 60HV, 120HV, 180HV, 240HV, etc.

That board is a 6oz / layer, 6 layer board -- for approx .060" copper -- VERY EXPENSIVE circuit board. The next heaviest board I've seen in the industry uses 3oz copper, eight layers -- 24oz vrs 36oz for our power board.

Patrick, help me understand one thing. You have mentioned the the hardware from the controllers mentioned above are not compatible with the Mamba software right? Please explain to me in terms that a non engineer guy can understand? I see other companies transform their aircraft controllers into car controllers and I would love to get my HV110 and possibly a SHV with a car software, not the Mamba, but something simple that would allow me to use a pistol radio and be able to use a car brake as I don't have many cars with mechanical brakes. I always thought it was just as simple as changing the software.

[Pdelcast]

Originally Posted by lutach

Patrick, help me understand one thing. You have mentioned the the hardware from the controllers mentioned above are not compatible with the Mamba software right? Please explain to me in terms that a non engineer guy can understand? I see other companies transform their aircraft controllers into car controllers and I would love to get my HV110 and possibly a SHV with a car software, not the Mamba, but something simple that would allow me to use a pistol radio and be able to use a car brake as I don't have many cars with mechanical brakes. I always thought it was just as simple as changing the software.

Well, it's the hardware on the control board that isn't compatible with the car software.

I designed the airplane controllers before the car controllers, and the car controller have some SERIOUS advancements over the airplane controllers in the sensitivity of the back-EMF circuit. (there is a patent on it too -- just got finalized.) http://www.freepatentsonline.com/y2007/0029956.html

So the car software just won't work on the airplane hardware -- different type of back-EMF sensing.

To run car software on the airplane power boards, I'd have to design a new control board for them.

But airplane power boards are really designed for airplanes - - not for the types of loads that cars put on a controller -- our car controllers ALSO use very heavy copper (6/6 on the MM, 6/6 + 4/3 on the MMM) but are designed to handle short term overload currents better than the airplane controllers. The MMM has the same number of FETs as the Phx-80, but handles over double the surge current and over double the continuous current. Part of that difference is the fan/heatsink, but the majority is the copper layout and current path copper total. The Phx-80 was designed to be light weight and compact, the MMM was designed to handle serious current surge and power.

[lutach]

Originally Posted by Pdelcast

Well, it's the hardware on the control board that isn't compatible with the car software.

I designed the airplane controllers before the car controllers, and the car controller have some SERIOUS advancements over the airplane controllers in the sensitivity of the back-EMF circuit. (there is a patent on it too -- just got finalized.) http://www.freepatentsonline.com/y2007/0029956.html

So the car software just won't work on the airplane hardware -- different type of back-EMF sensing.

To run car software on the airplane power boards, I'd have to design a new control board for them.

But airplane power boards are really designed for airplanes - - not for the types of loads that cars put on a controller -- our car controllers ALSO use very heavy copper (6/6 on the MM, 6/6 + 4/3 on the MMM) but are designed to handle short term overload currents better than the airplane controllers. The MMM has the same number of FETs as the Phx-80, but handles over double the surge current and over double the continuous current. Part of that difference is the fan/heatsink, but the majority is the copper layout and current path copper total. The Phx-80 was designed to be light weight and compact, the MMM was designed to handle serious current surge and power.

Ok so it has to do with the back-EMF mainly and then the amount of copper. So the SHV is the same way? Now what if the intended use for the HV and SHV controllers were to just lower the amount of AMPs used? Could it be possible for just a simple car software?

[Pdelcast]

Originally Posted by lutach

Ok so it has to do with the back-EMF mainly and then the amount of copper. So the SHV is the same way? Now what if the intended use for the HV and SHV controllers were to just lower the amount of AMPs used? Could it be possible for just a simple car software?

Well, the main difference between the airplane and car hardware is the smooth startup under heavy loads, and the ability to change power levels very quickly without upset of the back-EMF detection. Ever notice how most other sensorless controller bog down after cornering under heavy braking (when going from heavy brake to heavy throttle), and the Mamba doesn't? The Mamba has clean smooth starting and excellent "punch" because of the back-EMF design. I'm just not willing to compromise that high performance that the Mamba has.

I know you want a higher voltage Mamba -- I am looking into doing a 12S version, in addition to the 8S version.

Originally Posted by Pdelcast

I don't know if we had more sales than Traxxas -- just don't know how much Traxxas did.

Between our Industrial, Hobby, and Military controllers we build between 20,000 and 30,000 controllers a month. Hobby is about 85% of our business (but industrial and military are growing.)

My biggest issue is getting time to work on hobby controllers and projects -- too much other stuff always taking my time...

I win!!! I win!!!



Patrick, why go to Jamaica when you got that cute little Lotus you can drive all over the place? C'mon....that's GOTTA be a fun little car! (I dare you to throw a supercharger or turbo on it.....)

And DAMN. You had double the amount of sales as Traxxas did if Lutach's numbers are even somewhat close! Whew! Looks like I should take that part out of my post now huh? Haha!

So Patrick; ever thought about getting into the Electric Vehicle market? I bet you could make a pretty kickass controller for the next gen Tesla Roadster eh?

[Pdelcast]

Originally Posted by Five-oh-joe

I win!!! I win!!!



Patrick, why go to Jamaica when you got that cute little Lotus you can drive all over the place? C'mon....that's GOTTA be a fun little car! (I dare you to throw a supercharger or turbo on it.....)

And DAMN. You had double the amount of sales as Traxxas did if Lutach's numbers are even somewhat close! Whew! Looks like I should take that part out of my post now huh? Haha!

So Patrick; ever thought about getting into the Electric Vehicle market? I bet you could make a pretty kickass controller for the next gen Tesla Roadster eh?

Dude, I live in Kansas --- I don't think there is a curvy piece of road to drive my Lotus on in the entire state. It's sad, but I haven't had the Lotus out since March... :*(

We've been looking at the EV market very closely. There is a lot of potential there. :)

[lutach]

Originally Posted by Pdelcast

Dude, I live in Kansas --- I don't think there is a curvy piece of road to drive my Lotus on in the entire state. It's sad, but I haven't had the Lotus out since March... :*(

We've been looking at the EV market very closely. There is a lot of potential there. :)

I've been planning on building a electric race car for a long time now, but with the economy going the way it is, I'm having trouble finding some heavy hitter investors to jump in as well. I already found the motor, battery and a few chassis to use, but when the numbers came in I was like .

[Pdelcast]

Originally Posted by lutach

I've been planning on building a electric race car for a long time now, but with the economy going the way it is, I'm having trouble finding some heavy hitter investors to jump in as well. I already found the motor, battery and a few chassis to use, but when the numbers came in I was like .

Tell me about it... Did a quick SWAG at cost for a 640hp peak, 80hp continuous motor, controller, and Lithium battery (190V, 400AH) for an application -- came up with almost $200K.

The controller was the cheapest part.