How do you view buying/selling on ebay?

[TexasSP]

I try not to use ebay due to issues I have had and the way they protect buyers over sellers, but recently I had some items I couldn't get rid of by other means.

All were used from my trains and were engines that don't fit what I am modeling. All were in good working order and good aesthetic condition.

So I had a message from a guy toward the end of an auction who had already bid and was going to win. First off I ask questions before I bid, not after. Second I felt he would be a problem because he started questioning my description and clearly though it was a sound unit although I never stated nor alluded to it being that way. In fact I specifically stated it was not. Under new descriptions it would be but under old, which the unit is 6 years old it was not. However the description was still accurate and the information was all there.

The guy receives the unit on Friday and promptly sends me a message stating that it wasn't a Gold Series as I stated (which it was indicated buy the gold outlining on the box, the solver series has silver outlining) and that while it runs well as I said that rear truck was out of whack and not correct. I had owned two of these units since new and both were mechanically the same as when new.

I then offered for him to send the unit back and I would refund his purchase price minus shipping. He then responded that shipping was a hassle and he wanted his shipping costs returned and that he would attempt to fix it.

I sent a note back on Saturday evening asking for proof and stating how I was not thrilled with him basically calling me a liar. I asked for photos as proof. I get an email early Sunday morning stating he would and have not heard back sense.

So the first issue I have is that I think he is really suffering buyers remorse from not actually getting what he though because he did not read the auction completely. Second I feel like he is now trying to extort money from me but wants to offer now proof.

Lastly I look at buying used from individuals on ebay differently than buying from shops. To me it's a garage sale type transaction and unless the item I receive is drastically different, I don't worry about it, especially if the item is in good working order and I got a good deal. Secondly I take an inherent risk buying off ebay and check feedback of which I have 100% positive which speaks for itself.

I never described the item as new or like new either way and it performs as operates as stated. I don't feel I really owe this guy anything especially sense he has offered zero proof.

I have only had two issues in the past selling online and both from people who didn't know what they were buying. It just frustrates me that ebay leaves little recourse for sellers except to leave positive or no feedback. I miss seeing this because I would cancel bids from people with poor buyer feedback. It saved me hassles.

Anyway, opinions please.

1. Buy from long term, reputable people/companies with good transaction histories and feedback

2. Use payapl with authenticated address and accounts. Use secondary checking account to prevent any "incidents" on your primary account weather via checking, debit or credit card

3. Email/phone people/companies if you have questions. If they are slow or unwilling to respond, take that as a bad sign.

4. Use your gut instinct, if something doesn't feel right or is to good to be true, it probably is.

5. Use proper and complex passwords for your accounts. NEVER give out info and NEVER tell computer to store password information.

7. Make sure your Windows patchs and antivirus/spyware software are up to date.

8. Request detailed photo's of product if current ones are subpar in quality and detail

9. Get an Ebay/paypal token security key card for increased account security

10. Above all, USE COMMON SENSE

[nitrostarter]

I had the same thing. Sold an Ipod touch on ebay. Sold it as is, like new but in great working condition. Buyer contacted me stating it was not new and they wanted a refund. I said refer back to the ad, it said "like new" and "sold as is". I didn't hear anything again...

Hey Tex,
I am starting to feel the same, that eBay just isn't worth it. The deal with the sellers having no recourse is frustrating and then you come across someone who is either stupid or lying just kills it. And I have noticed since you can no longer leave negative feedback for the buyer that these types of incidents have gone up, for me anyways. People are never satisfied it seems.

I have seen how you treat people on here for some time now and read feedback that they have left when you work a deal out, so I am sure you have been more than fair with this guy. Reading is basic, if he didn't read the whole auction or did not ask you specific questions what can you do. I mean hell you offered his money back, if it is such a big deal then shipping shouldn't be a problem.

And if all else fails them him it is as John Wayne said "..life is tough, it is tougher when you are stupid."

[PBO]

Originally Posted by TexasSP

Anyway, opinions please.

Ebay is full of delightful people who are as you've described...armed with a sliver of information/education they bid on junk they know little about & get upitty when they receive goods they feel or ultimately realise they shouldn't have bought

My wife sells 'collectables' on ebay as a hobby. She views these people as a cost of selling on ebay. And then there are always those who think they can weasel the goods for free & hold the seller to ransom over small issues

Brief scenario; my wife lists an item using phrases such as 'like', 'style' or 'appears' to describe something she can't positively identify as a certain make or type. Buyer knows a little (enough to be dangerous) & thinks they've found something incredibly valuable. Buyer gets greedy & bids to win. Buyer receives item & promptly takes it to a valuer, only to discover it not a 'whatever make' but is in fact valued at the price point they paid (amazing how the market knows that!!). Buyer gets back in contact making all sorts of accusations, demanding a full refund & my wife panics a little & misses an early opportunity to shut the stupidity down...goes backward & forward, ebay sits on the fence & does nothing, buyer become a PITA quickly, cost more in return shipping than the goods are worth from the buyers country...purchase price is refunded less shipping. Net result = buyer gets item, seller gets zero

Ebay is full of these people, some countries have more than others & my wife now includes the line "item listed elsewhere, seller reserves the right to terminate auction early" just to cut the nut bags out of the loop - should she need to because ebay don't or won't do much to assist even though they make good money from my wife

[BrianG]

Keep it nice guys. I have edited/deleted posts that could cause things to go out of hand.

Anyway, back to the original post: I am VERY leary about selling on ebay for just the reasons pointed out. That and the listing, final sale, and paypal fees are getting outrageous. I generally sell here or craigslist and use ebay only for buying. If I do sell on ebay, it's usually low price stuff where if I get scammed, it's not really a huge deal (but still frustrating).

[reno911]

I bought once here and was refused a refund, not evan a partial, I am sure you are in the right on this one by offering one. He bought used, got something that he may have avoided if reading the auction in full. Got mad at himself mostly, and tried to pull a fast one since he was mad. By refusing the refund you pretty much have a one up on him if it ever goes into a paypal dispute. Just show the evidence that you were to provide a full refund if the item was shipped back. He really has no leverage after that.

[TexasSP]

Thanks for the replies, just wanted to make sure I wasn't crazy. It appears also that disputes all go through ebay now if bought/sold on ebay and not paypal so the dispute has to be through ebay. I offered him what ebay shows as the final scenario that they come to which is if all else fails return the item and get your money back. The item sold for 60, retails new for around 130, and he paid 21 cents less for shipping than it cost me (I miscalculated shipping costs).

I try to deal honestly with people and offer good prices, I am just trying to recoup a little money to put somewhere else into my hobby, not make a profit by any means. After all, I surely don't make anyone bid on my stuff.

What frustrates me is that every time this has happened the message starts out the same "I never had a problem before on here before but......."

I think the next items will go on craigslist or if I can find a train forum that has a for sale section I will go there. It just eats me up when I know what I sold and I am being as honest as possible when selling.

[BP-Revo]

eBay has gone to crap lately. I haven't sold anything on there in years, despite having a 100% positive feedback for selling (I have one Negative feedback when buying because the seller left me "retaliation" negative feedback when I left him some). FYI my dad and I share an eBay account.

The new rules protect eBay more than anyone else. In most cases, the seller just gets screwed. I may buy off there once in a while but usually not.

[JERRY2KONE]

I stopped using ebay a few years ago completely after being hacked three times. I made a few purchases that were very gratifying, but dealing with one bad apple just leaves a bad feeling. Things started out fairly nice, but over the years this site has become too much of a PITA to use safely and without risk. Not sure why the management of ebay have let things get so out of hand, but I am sure that they have gotten tired of dealing with so many arguements as well. I have made many R/C purchases on Ebay, but have never sold anything on there, and now with the way they are handling things I never will.

I have a close personal friend who was doing a very large resale type business on Ebay as well, and seemed to be making quite a lot of money doing so. He was buying up "close out" or liquidation sale items from The Home Depot, and Lowes usually at 10% of their listed retail value, and then re-selling them at wholesale prices on ebay. And at least trippling his investment or better. It seemed pretty trivial up front at first, but once you saw how much stuff he was selling it added up to quite a nice profit. For instance he picked up a pallet load of switches for like $15 and sold $300 switches for $2 a piece. All for a side source of income. He started out just filling his weekends with something to do, and soon was making more money doing business on ebay than on his regular job, and he was making nearly $100K as a PC tech/administrator with a very large company. He finally got tired of dealing with all of the lawyer like crap that was going on within Ebay and just sold everything off and closed his ebay accounts. He left with his sales rated around 98% and has not looked back.

Just find another way.

I sold a 1/16 E-Revo on the bay last year. It was in awesome condition. I was so sure that it was an awesome deal I gave MY cellphone number on the receipt. After the buyer receives the truck, I get a call saying it doesnt even work. I called BS because I drove the car(to bring the lipo to storage voltage) just minutes before I packaged it. He said the antennae wire on the Spektrum receiver was cut. He threatened to leave negative feedback unless I helped him out. I refunded him $50.

Heres what he got:
Month old Mini Revo in great condition.
1 week old Spektrum DX3s
4 2S Flighmaxx lipos
2 3S Turnigy lipos
1 charger
Full set of Hot Racing push rods and tie-rods
T-Bone racing bumper
3 sets of tires(one brand new)
lipo sack

It cost me about $650 for everything. Sold it for $400 shipped which cost me $25. Then I refunded the $50. So long story short, The buyer got a 2 month old, awesome condition Mini Revo with 6 new lipos and a charger and a new DX3s for $350 shipped. And for that reason I sell everything "As Is".

I know its a used truck, but if anyone on this forum received it they would have been more than happy with it, and realized the hell of a deal I gave them.

I would feel like crap if I sold him a lemon, but I know for a fact it was working and he got the deal of a lifetime. Oh well, live and learn.

[pinkpanda3310]

I do buy stuff from ebay but not sell. It's unfortunate that you have to think ahead of all the a$$H0L3S that lurk there, whether you buy or sell. I agree with all the above, you come across like a decent fella Tex and I would think you are covered as you offered a full refund.

[DwightSchrute]

i too, try to steer of ebay now.

after almost 700 perfect feedback, as a seller i feel like i'm constantly getting threatened with negative feedback if i don't bend over backwards to accommodate the buyer anyway he/she sees fit.

more than that, i'm seeing people just plain trying to negotiate money from the auction cost after it's been received to get a better deal. it's happend to me 3 times in the past 4months.

in the case where the person demanded a complete refund, (i also state in my auctions, no refunds) i asked them to send it back but they want me to cover shipping so i think that was a case of buyers's remourse because it was a NIB item.

i refuse to sell rc car stuff there anymore.

I also say in my auctions that i need payment within 24 hours. the last auction, someone thought it would be funny to pay me 4 days later. So i waited 2 days to ship it for every one he made me wait. i don't care if i get negative feedback anymore on ebay. people take sooooo much advantage of the garage sale sellers, it's sad.


i've taken to rc-tech where i feel the people there are much more honest in their dealings.

Which is ironic considering i've found RC tech to be the biggest collection of stuck up, know it all a-holes this side of the internet beyond the NASIOC forums. So glad i'm not a Subaru owner anymore, whata bunch of douches....

[TexasSP]

Guess what, to follow up the guy stated last Sunday morning he would send me pics as proof. Being Saturday afternoon and almost 1 week later I have heard zero from him and have no pics of anything. It's not that hard to get a hold of a digital camera in this day and age and send them. So, I am convinced now the guy is a liar, and even if he does send pictures it's too late. He could easily try to manufacture his own pictures and make it appear there is a defect.

I don't care if I get negative feedback now, I will answer accordingly and report him to ebay. If they do nothing then oh well, I will stop using them. It seems there are less real deals to be had on there now anyway. So many sellers have even higher prices than the regular retail shops anyway so whats the point.