Westboro baptist church - Page 2 - RC-Monster Forums

TexasSP · 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by josh9mille

inspired/influenced.....yup that sounds about right. It was written by man back when we were more gullible and dumb than we are now

Exactly! Kinda reminds me of the the movie "The invention of Lying" Still cracks me up when I think about that movie.

You basically have no argument here just snide remarks. You also offer no evidence or proof of your argument.

If you don't believe, then why does it matter to you so much? If you believe people are free, then why not let them be free?

You also seem to be on some kind of attack path since this was also brought up in another thread by you. In that thread it had nothing to do with any of the posts, you just sort of sprang it up out of the blue. Why? After all it's a tech thread about motors overheating.......

Quote:

Originally Posted by PBO

The lunatic fringe will always be there...it's just a question of how much lunacy is extolled when compared to the average

Not religious myself, nor are my family & we have an interesting situation at my childrens school...the debate over whether ethics should be taught as an elective alternative to religious studies

My daughter chooses to visit the school library instead of attending the classes - which is fine as she's a librarian but she wants to attend ethics classes. My son visits different religious classes depending on which one he thinks will be most fun or gives him the best rewards for attending (here's my first issue). There has been an ethics class trialed at the school & it went well by all accounts however the religious voice dominated subsequent post trial discussions & the insipid school administration caved in to their demands

So the first issue I have is with my son being given vouchers for McDonalds or similar junk food places - why is a bribe required or offered? I can't understand the arguments offered to prostitute religion

Second issue is with the simmering fear that so many religious people appear have when alternatives are put forward. We are supposed to live in a tolerant society, that accepts people of any race, creed, belief etc

The situation surrounding this ethics debate, in my view puts the religious element at the school into the wacko, paranoid set & this damages the values they try & promote. My daughter especially is developing an unhealthy disrespect for religion in general because she sees the hypocrisy in the situation & she sees the parents & the school promoting it. Sad times for religion

I really have no understanding or frame of reference for what you are talking about here. What does Mc Donald's have to do with it? Not trying to be combative, just trying to understand/clarify? I have family from Melbourne who were visiting with us the other day while on their vacation and even while on the subject this never came up. My cousin has been in Australia for 12 years and his wife is a native born Australian.

It's funny but many of us have explained that religion is of no use to us. Being a Christian has nothing to do with religion in any form. Religion itself is actually counter to what the Bible teaches. Most specifically Jesus ranted more against religion and zealotry than anything else.

If anyone would do a little research instead of trying to lump everyone together you would understand this. WBC is nothing more than some family members and close friends who have formed a hate club together under the guise and protection of being a "church". The daughter is a lawyer whose sole purpose is to insure their activities fall under the full protection of the law at all times. So the actual church has nothing to do with it for them other than offering them the cover of legal protection the need to propagate their hate. It is not the only method WBC uses to cover themselves legally. Of course we have a counter to this which is the Patriot Guard whose sole purpose is to legally counter the activities of WBC and others like them. This is the motorcycle group which travels to soldiers funerals and blocks access of the funerals and proceedings from WBC and their members as well as others who seek to protest soldiers' funerals. I have seen them in action locally and they are quite effective.

My curiosity can't help to make me wonder why so many on that claim to be Atheist claim the science on this is closed. Many physicists and other scientists completely disagree with the argument and have evidence of their theories as well. To me shutting a book and saying that's that in the science world is counter to what science is and stands for.

No different than people misinterpreting writings in the bible and refusing to understand it properly. To understand the nature of God you have to speak with God first and foremost. The Bible is secondary to that. Too many seem to think that the Bible dictates God and how he is to behave and act while it is God who dictated the Bible. Christianity is about a relationship first and foremost between an individual and God. Each one is as unique as any other relationship. Getting wrapped into rules and religion puts a rift in that relationship. God sets no rules about how you approach him. He gives you guidelines for living and helps direct your life but again that comes as part of the relationship not vise versa.

Of course what many of you don't understand is most of us who believe came into a relationship on our own terms in our own way. We did not get their because of what the Bible said or someone else did but because of who God is and because we chose to give ourselves the chance to have the relationship.

When I am confused about it I go straight to the source which is God himself. I would bet that I actually have more issues with religion than most Atheists.

How many of you who make claims against religion have ever tried to honestly seek the chance that God could be real? I am not talking in fully believing but just allowing the chance that he is real? Isn't good science about allowing for all possibilities?

I think many of you just assume I and others never allowed for other possibilities, which in my case is the opposite from the truth.

I also think it is assumed that people like me just ignore science, which again, is the opposite of the truth. In fact quantum physics flat out excites me! The fact the the existence of a single atom affects the entire universe and how things would be different it did not exist. Science just further reaffirms my beliefs and faith.

BrianG · 09.30.2011, 10:27 AM

I grew up in a religious household. For the first 4 years of school (K-3) my classes were taught by Catholic nuns in the basement of a church. From then on (the school closed), I went to Sunday school, went through the sacraments, etc. But as I grew older and despite all this, my "scientific" mind wants proof. Until then, I don't believe in any "higher power" (much to the dismay of my mother). My mind is open though, just waiting for some non-circumstantial evidence (other than "we don't know why this is why things are, so it must be God" type of arguments)...

Anyway, most religions have one thing in common when boiled down: Be nice (basically). It doesn't take a religious person to realize that everyone should be free to live their life in the way they see fit as long as it doesn't infringe upon someone else's rights. So, I guess I'm an "Old Testament" kind of guy; "an eye for an eye". You leave me alone, I gladly leave you alone. You try to mess with me, you get it back and then some. I feel that if everyone had that kind of attitude, those extremists/religious nutjobs would be treated how they should be treated; with "extreme prejudice".

josh9mille · 09.30.2011, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TexasSP

You basically have no argument here just snide remarks. You also offer no evidence or proof of your argument.

If you don't believe, then why does it matter to you so much? If you believe people are free, then why not let them be free?

You also seem to be on some kind of attack path since this was also brought up in another thread by you. In that thread it had nothing to do with any of the posts, you just sort of sprang it up out of the blue. Why? After all it's a tech thread about motors overheating.......

You are right, I have no proof to back up my argument, but then again neither do you....on anything. But then again saying that the bible was written by man is a pretty safe assumption, and man makes mistakes and have inaccuracies when remembering things as they write them down. And im sorry my remarks have offended you. The one in the thread about motors was just a joke, Im sorry you dont share my sense of humor. I just find it humorous that most of the population has been scared into believing something, and if they dont believe then bad things will happen to them. What kind of a god would be so mean?

09.30.2011, 02:45 PM

I completely agree with Tex and i go by what God wants and if i need it explained, i look up and FIND an explaination in the Bible. And Josh, I have a great since of humor until someone insults my faith and especially my God, every comment you have made has been uncalled for which i don't understand sense u dont believe anyway. If you aren't worried, then why so combative? And i'm not worried about God doing something to me, i am worried what the devil may do to me if i dont have God on my side.

TexasSP · 09.30.2011, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by josh9mille

You are right, I have no proof to back up my argument, but then again neither do you....on anything. But then again saying that the bible was written by man is a pretty safe assumption, and man makes mistakes and have inaccuracies when remembering things as they write them down. And im sorry my remarks have offended you. The one in the thread about motors was just a joke, Im sorry you dont share my sense of humor. I just find it humorous that most of the population has been scared into believing something, and if they dont believe then bad things will happen to them. What kind of a god would be so mean?

What exactly am I scared of? Fear is certainly not what motivates my faith.

As for the argument it was one you started, not me. I only interceded with my perspective. I can't force anyone to believe anything based on faith. This is the nature of faith, going beyond what you can simply experience physically.

I talk with atheists and agnostics quite often (one of my brothers is agnostic), mutual respect is what allows us to have good conversations. We don't have to even respect each others beliefs, we just have to respect each other. I don't tell them I think they're going to hell and they don't tell me I believe in fairy tails. It's quite simple. I actually find discussions with those of beliefs that differ from mine quite interesting. But again, mutual respect must be shown.

I have friends from all different cultures, backgrounds, and faiths as well of those that have no faith. It's interesting what can be talked about when respect is first and foremost and we put the insults and stereotypes aside.

Finnster · 05:46 PM

How many problems could be solved if God decided to hold a weekly telecon? Shouldn't be all that much trouble for the all-powerful Creator to have a bit of face time with the model of his image to clear some things up.

Boom, open up the skies on Sunday, and lets have a weekly Q&A, just like a football coach does after every game.

Q: WBC?
GOD: No, someone's looking to get smoted

Q: Gays in military?
GOD: You guys aren't supposed to be fighting in the first place...What part of thou shalt not kill do you not understand?

Q: That hurricane last week, what was up with that? U mad bro?
GOD: Pppssstt. That's global warming fools. U did that. I didn't make dinosaurs for 200 million years for you to burn them all up in 100 and mess all my creation up. Didn't Al Gore tell you guys? I told him all about it in that peice of toast I devined my image in a while back. Should have never smoted the T-rexes, they were totally awesome. Should have had a plague of them instead of a bunch of stupid crickets. That would have gotten your attention. Miss those guys...

Q: Man.. The Red Sox.. how much do they suck?
GOD: Dude, Big Time. Don't come crying to me asking to hit your homers for you. I don't care and I'm busy anyway. Stop asking me to win you a Grammy too. You whine as much as the Keelians..

Q: Wait, what, who?
A: Uhhh... what?

Q: No no no.... we heard it. Who the F is that? Did you make some other creation behind our back?
GOD: Ahhh, damn... I mean, look... Its just not the same as it was back then in Jerusalem. Everything was better back then, you guys were new and fun and exciting, we has a bright future to look forward too... Then you had to go and kill my boy. Do you think I would just get over that?

Q: Oh god, are you going to bring that up again? It wasn't our fault anyway. Have you seen all the statues we built for him? How many times can we say we're sorry?
GOD: Like it helps any! Could you bring him back? No, I did. After that, I wanted to move on, make some other creations from the things I learned here.

Q: ?

GOD: I mean, you guys are kinda lame. Sure you invented planes and rockets and cool stuff like that, but you're pretty weak and break easy. Never did like the ape look anyway. Ugh, making you bald didn't help either. Should've gone with the squirrel monkey theme.. I was on fire that day

So I made some other dudes. Maybe a bunch of other dudes. The Dragonians are awesome. They are like 40ft tall and have huge teeth and wings and can change colors and have four arms and shoot fire and lighting. Plus they actually listen to the stuff I say.
You know, you guys can have free will without being such d1cks about it. How many holocausts have you had now? And you guys have nearly killed all my rhinos and tigers.... You think I just come up with cool things like that everyday?

Q: What?! You said you made us in your image!
GOD: Yeah, but I didn't say of which part.

Q: Oh, we see how it is then... so what does this mean, are you leaving us?
GOD: No no no baby. They are in another galaxy. Don't worry. I put them far away from you so you couldn't possibly make them extinct.
I'll still be around, maybe not as much as I was in the old days when I was burning bushes and stuff.. Plus, you guys got like 5 billion years before the Sun explodes. I'm sure you guys can find a way off before then if you don't kill yourselves first. I'll be around watching. G/L

suicideneil · 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fast5sRevo88

I completely agree with Tex and i go by what God wants and if i need it explained, i look up and FIND an explaination in the Bible. And Josh, I have a great since of humor until someone insults my faith and especially my God, every comment you have made has been uncalled for which i don't understand sense u dont believe anyway. If you aren't worried, then why so combative? And i'm not worried about God doing something to me, i am worried what the devil may do to me if i dont have God on my side.

How do you know what god wants you to do in any given situation- god has never spoken to anyone directly, ever, nor given anyone instructions- the bible is a book, written by a 3rd party, it no more conveys gods desires than it does the persons who wrote it. Interpreting a random event or coincidence as divine instruction makes a person either extremely naive, or extremely gullible if a pedo in a robe tells them that said random occurrences are to seen as commandments from god.

Start thinking for yourself and use commonsense & your own judgment to know what to do in & with your life, stop relying on fairy stories to tell you what to do...

http://www.wallchan.com/images/sandb...us-atheist.jpg

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-TmMFVlysPw...-wallpaper.jpg

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-q3OGLdvYgx...aper-31925.jpg

http://images2.fanpop.com/image/phot...4-1280-800.jpg

http://www.wallchan.com/images/sandb...-wallpaper.jpg

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_4C_tSMqS81...t+Einstein.JPG

http://www.heavingdeadcats.com/wp-co...gh-300x297.gif

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_4C_tSMqS81...B.+Anthony.JPG

http://fc01.deviantart.net/fs44/f/20..._Unikraken.png

09.30.2011, 06:25 PM

You have no idea what you are talking about, Neil.

PBO · 09.30.2011, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TexasSP

I really have no understanding or frame of reference for what you are talking about here. What does Mc Donald's have to do with it? Not trying to be combative, just trying to understand/clarify? I have family from Melbourne who were visiting with us the other day while on their vacation and even while on the subject this never came up. My cousin has been in Australia for 12 years and his wife is a native born Australian.

The McDonalds reference is simple, my son receives a free food voucher for McDonalds each time he attends the scripture classes taught be a certain religion. I've never had a sensible answer to my questions directed at the 'teacher' or the school as to why they are given out. In my view it's a blatant bribe & one I'd prefer not have in school or my house

A point I didn't explain is that if my kids do go to the library during scripture classes they aren't permitted to read or write - they are expected (& in theory supervised) to just sit quietly. My daughter refuses to just sit & does her librarian duties however this is a clear form of punishment in my view & little wonder my son wanders through the different scripture classes looking for bribes. A pathetic & easily changed situation if approached with respect - there's little of that from the religious element in the school though

I'm with Brian - treat everyone as you would want them to treat you. If you stuff that up, you deserve what's coming & if distilled down to a simple point, this is what my kids are taught

09.30.2011, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PBO

The McDonalds reference is simple, my son receives a free food voucher for McDonalds each time he attends the scripture classes taught be a certain religion. I've never had a sensible answer to my questions directed at the 'teacher' or the school as to why they are given out. In my view it's a blatant bribe & one I'd prefer not have in school or my house

A point I didn't explain is that if my kids do go to the library during scripture classes they aren't permitted to read or write - they are expected (& in theory supervised) to just sit quietly. My daughter refuses to just sit & does her librarian duties however this is a clear form of punishment in my view & little wonder my son wanders through the different scripture classes looking for bribes. A pathetic & easily changed situation if approached with respect - there's little of that from the religious element in the school though

I'm with Brian - treat everyone as you would want them to treat you. If you stuff that up, you deserve what's coming & if distilled down to a simple point, this is what my kids are taught

I agree that no one should be forced or bribed into being a Christian, it has to be freewill. Also i used to go to churches that made me feel like i was being punished, but since then i have got in a church that actually believes and allows us to get excited an make "noise" for Jesus.

Finnster · 09.30.2011, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fast5sRevo88

You have no idea what you are talking about, Neil.

IDK, but he has no idea how to post pix w/o totally screwing up the thread.

I do like the quote of Carlin tho asking why God is trying to bum people for money.
Carlin was hilarious :)

TexasSP · 09.30.2011, 10:27 PM

Can we delete neils post so the thread can actually be read?

As for the money part. A tithe is an act of faith. It's not something people are supposed to ask others to do but something God asked of us as an act of faith. God knows money is the most powerful human force and while he doesn't need our act of surrendering shows faith in him. A tithe doesn't necessarily mean giving money directly yo a church but to whatever it is God directs you personally to give to.

As for the McDonald's thing that is stupid. Bribing anyone to go to church or scripture classes is wrong and counter to what the Bible teaches. God gave people the freedom to choose so who is man to counter that and try to force or bribe people into choosing? Public schools here are not allowed to offer spiritual classes of any type. Private schools are a different matter.

People are free to choose their own way. I don't make cracks at those that don't believe nor do I chastise or make fun of them. I only feel sorry for those that feel the need to do those things to me or others who believe in God. As it is, making fun of people and offering silly remarks is no way for you to endear them to your cause no matter what side of it your beliefs lie.

10.01.2011, 11:59 AM

Can't say I don't believe in God but can't say that I am religious either. After all each and every religion says that they have it all worked out right and every other religion is wrong. Makes me think....... Reason why I don't really belong to any religion. I guess you could kind of call me half Atheist but I would never slam down anybodies religion or insult them based on their beliefs (as long as they don't mean or do harm to other people). Even if you want to believe and pray to a three headed goat what the heck has that got to do with me???? Also making statements about getting rid of religion makes you in some ways very similar to the idiots that this thread was started about. They are depriving people of their rights to live a free life without persecution so telling someone they shouldn't have a religion is kind of in the same boat. Don't people have the right to believe? I think so.

Getting back to the topic of the thread:

Gay people? What the heck has it got to do with me who one takes to bed with them? As long as I don't have to be there I couldn't care less.

Gays in the military? Why not? Let them. I sure as heck don't want to be shot at and anyone who wants to take that place instead of me gets my respect.

Gay teachers? I had a gay teacher at school. Last time I checked my girlfriend had a vagina so I am guessing that I didn't turn out gay.

I really find it hard to understand why so many religious people choose to persecute gays. I think everybody should have the freedom to live their lives as they want to (as long as they aren't hurting anyone).

suicideneil · 02:21 PM

Strange, they were smaller when I found them...

Answer me this peeps: why is it that you are told so often to never question 'gods will' and gods actions when something terrible happens, but to heap praise upon him when something good happens?

Could it actually be that god does not exist, therefore good and bad things happen for their own reasons, and not because some invisible old man in the sky clicked his fingers? If you start questioning things like any logical, forward-thinking person would, you very quickly come to the conclusion that you cannot question nor test that which does not exist...

If you even refuse to consider the possibility, then the church / your parents have done a great job of brainwashing you- this is another good one:

[youtube]jxo81Ok9Urk[/youtube]

see: brainwashing/ use of fear to enforce religious ideals; they have you so worried about what will happen to you if you don't believe in their tripe, you cannot allow yourself to consider the other answers out there ( that explain the universe, where we came from & why we are here ).

10.01.2011, 09:48 PM

Niel, why does it bother you so much what people believe and why are you trying so hard to convince them they are wrong? I hope it isn't anything personal or really bad that happened to you but why can't you let people believe and have faith? What is so wrong with it? I don"t see how it is hurting you.

I am not religious but my parents and my younger brother are. They used to pester me a lot to join them in their faith and beliefs but I simply told them I'll leave you alone as long as you leave me alone. So they don't have to listen to my Atheist views and they wont preach religion to me. I don't think it is religion that started so many wars. After all almost all religions preach about peace and respect for others. What causes wars is telling people that what they believe is garbage, wrong or even worse try to stop them and take away their religion. We have no reason to do so.