MGM 160/24 PLANE ESC - Can't Program It?!?!?!

Hey all - hoping i can get some advice or tips or anything i can get! -lol- Got 3 problems here - hoping u guys are feeling merry and helpful! -lol-

#1
I am having some problems trying to program my ESC. It is an MGM-Compro 160/24 Plane ESC, but i am running it in a converted Team Losi LST, with 18 nimh cells and a lehner 2230 11 wind motor. I am using mechanical brakes, and a Futaba 3PM-FM 'Megatech' radio.

I have had the thought that the ESC may need a "Stick" radio to be used instead of the pistol grip radio? I am hoping i don't need to change from my pistol grip radio to a stick radio - if that's the case, i'll need to buy another controller to substitute, as i hate sticks for land vehicles -lol-

I've tried all my different throttle trim settings, but can only get one outcome, or the other... If i leave the TX alone, and plug in the batteries, it will just sit there and beep at me - i feel it is the "0.25 second delay" beeps.

*i am getting either of the following two 'outcomes'...

a) (with no throttle pressed) series of beeps (have a feeling it's the 0.25 delay constant beeps) OR

b)(with no throttle pressed) 2 beeps - 10 second delay - 3 beeps - bout 3 second delay - then 4 short beeps - then red LED turns off and nothing.

Usually i get 'outcome a' with the throttle trim at zero, and pressing nothing. If i change the throttle trim up to about 64 (towards brake) i get 'outcome b' - but with trim at 63 - i get 'outcome b'. Same thing with sub trim - one or the other.

Sort of as if there's no neutral or something? I've also tried ending with throttle max brake instead of leaving it sit - just do

I also get 'outcome b' with throttle pressed full the whole time...

#2
Having probs with the USB aswell.... the PC makes the lil noise (same one as when any USB device is connected) but when i connect the USBCOM - it makes a similar - but different noise - and i don't get the lil msg where i can click the bubble to install drivers for the device etc that usually comes up in the bottom right corner in windows XP. Is there a way i can manually do this?

#3
Crap - one other thing -lol- I have probs with the mechanical brake - When the TX hits Forward throttle - the ESC is forwards, but the brake servo is actually braking...when the TX hits brakes - the ESC hits brakes - but the servo lets go of brakes...

So they are swapped and reversed to one another if that makes sense.... from the RX - they're connected as this....
RX--->FailSafe--->Y-Harness--->splits to esc and mechanical brake servo.


Sorry for the encyclopedia of questions - but is there anything you fellas can do to help me out here on either of the probs i'm having? I am desperate to get this truck up and running - the wait has been too long already! -lol-

[Batfish]

I've got a few seconds before I let the kids open the presents and may be able to help with 1 and 3.
Chances are they are the same issue. Check your radio and see if you have the throttle channel reversed. The exact same things happened to me when I tried to program my MGM car controller with the throttle channel reversed.

Hope this helps - Merry Christmas!

haha - i tried that one -lol- Merry xmas to you too! :D

But i have figured that it must be correct on the throttle reverse situation - as when i get the "outcome B" (above - #1) on the ESC it is only when the brake servo is moved to the "braking position" - but for the ESC to get to "outcome B" the TX must have been put into forward throttle (as noted by the ESC), otherwise it would start the beeping.......right? -lol-

just got a reply over on another forum..... sounds like my worst fears in the whole world have just been semi-kinda-confirmed...this is what was posted :(

***START***
"I think your are going to have problems with a pistol style radio as the controller is expecting either -100% (full off) to arm, or +100% (full on) to go into programing mode. The neutral point on a pistol will be 0% which the controller interprets as half throttle.

This is due to being an Aircraft mode ESC, not car/boat style."
***END***

mannnnn - anyone got some suggestions on a replacement ESC if it's needed? :(

mmk - i think i might save myself the hassles - and grab the NEW 160/24 controller for cars - it isn't listed on their website yet - but DOES exist - so might be a goer for me i think....i've just received 2 emails back from MGM (who btw replied within the first 24 hours of the first email - replying ON BOXING DAY - and then i sent em another email and they have replied again already - not bad if ya ask me -lol-)

mmmk - scrap above comment - editing half way through posting -lol-
I just also received an email back from Mr Constructor aswell....
SO - now i have a few conflicting theories - i think i had better have another look at it - i possibly have overlooked something hopefully?? I dunno - i will get back to you guys later on - just thought i better update - going rc drifting now, so will look at it later tonight -lol- If i cant get it myself - i might have a go at the new car controller -lol-

btw - thanks everyone for your input!!!!!

Here's the replies etc

***START FIRST EMAIL***
Dear Daniel,

it is no good idea using plane controller in the car. Car/boat controller is
available up to 160A nad 24 cells (on the www is 160A and 16 cells only). It
is no possible use plane controller with pistol Tx with neutral position.
See on attached manual for car/boats ESC possibilities.

Which 160/24 ESC you have? Is it Profi line or Expert ESC? Which SW version
is your 160/24 ESC?

Best regards,
Grisa


----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent: Sunday, December 25, 2005 7:43 AM
Subject: 160/24 ESC Programming Troubles!

***FINISH FIRST EMAIL***

***START SECOND EMAIL***
Dear Daniel,

TMM® 16016-3 CAR/BOAT (s)" ESC work only up to 16 cells, really.
Some modelers want car or boat controller up to 24 cell.
Therefore we started production a new ESC TMM® 16024-3 CAR/BOAT which work
up to 24 cells (8 Lipol) - it is no on www (and on the manual) yet. We will
put it on www arround half of January (together with some other news).
Dimensions is the same as 16cell/160A controller ("cube" version is
recomended). It is OPTO version without BEC.

If you have troubles with programming your plane 160/16 ESC Expert by PC,
download actual programm "controller" with actual data from our www. It is
possible you have CD (you buy it together with USBCOM module) with oldest SW
or data version then is need for your ESC.

Best regards,
Grisa


----- Original Message -----
From:
To: ""Ing. G. Dvorský""
Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2005 12:13 AM
Subject: Re: 160/24 ESC Programming Troubles!

***FINISH SECOND EMAIL***



***START MR CONSTRUCTOR***
So let´s come to the problems:

with any radio, fully trim it to neutral, any exponential out, the
trigger has to be 50/50 set, some radios have a very fine sub trim,
check this too.
The second version of beeps is the one you´re into the programming then,
(if this is done by having no throttle, then reverse the channel and
check the fine adjustments too)
I do know from myself that these esc´s tend to locate the neutral point
(even if settled to 50%50) a little in the backward section, this could
be trimmed off later, this might occur on some radios, but it is not a
bog thing, only trim it ba 5% or less and then you have the full neutral
at your mid neutral from the pistol radio.

I do use a pistol radio too, several others do use a pistol too, none of
them having any trouble, it is possible to use these esc´s with a pistol
radio.

The USB drivers have to be isntalled BEFORE the first connection will be
done, install them in the folder you prefer, i ´ll give you a manual
included in this mail, should be helpful.
then the controller needs to be connected to the usb com, then
everything into the pc, read the manual for further details, as some pc
kits might need the esc to be powered with juice from a battery pack and
are not powered from the usb port.

and as for the programming itself here are a few helpful tipps too: (see
attached pic for details)
A: normally leave the settled points, only if everything fails or the
esc isn´t useable on your radio, try to dial it in with these settings.
B: set it to 2 poles and the ratio to 1:1
C: best try to use it in basic mode, if that doesn´t fit fully your
needs go for aircraft mode
D: OK; it should be set to nimh/nicd off course, if ya run lipo and nimh
mixed set up the correct lipo mode (the nimh´s will not get fully empty,
but they´re on the safe side.
E: best: no brake, as the motor will not braked down as the tranny might
cause to fail if the motor will be breaked down too fast, if any break
must be dialed in, go for the softest you could.
F: the accleration is normally set to 0,2 sec (or around in the car
esc´s) so choose between these first values, too hard accleration might
damage the tranny, so try the 0,29 sec. setup first.
G: set it to automatic, this automatic wil be very good but in some
cases the motors will stutter at around 85 % of rpm when throttled to
full rpm, this could be solved when using the timing settings above 15°
H: a good starting point wich is safe for both lipo and nimh will be the
3,1V setting. the others will not empty the battery fully, but in some
times it´ll be better not to fully empty them, so use it as a safety
feature for not draining your batts too much
I: Is useless for us as this point normally will not be shown on the
opto esc´s

hopefully there are a few things cleared up.

a word on the programming: if you´ve entered it, the time between the
settings is unlimited !! and EACH setting will be done once, then wait
for the corresponding beeps that the esc has the right setting, then
it´ll go to the next point, the setting has nothing in common to many
other esc, they need to be pushed till throttle after having reached the
certain amount of beeps or similar, this setting is stressless, you
could easily wait and setup all paramaters you like, but best is when
you use the small table with all the para´meters shown, you could follow
the setup better and could mark up the settings you made !!

Good Luck.

Greetings from Hamburg and a happy new year !!
***END MR CONSTRUCTOR***

OK - so tried all that out last night - and got nowhere - i dunno what's going on! -lol-

I also tried the PC programming on another PC - got the USB working - but now it wont respond to the controller - i even went and downloaded the new USBCOM data from the MGM website - but still didn't work.

It's halfway there - i mean - it recognises the USBCOM now - but wont recongnise that the controller has been connected - this is following all directions from manual - and some of my own combinations of hooking it up. batts have been connected too - but it just doesn't recognise that it's there.... strange :?

i dunno what i'm gonna do - Mr C says it CAN be used with a pistol TX - as he or some ppl he knows uses it themselves - so it must be possible... i had a thought maybe it's the 3PM i'm running?? i've sent an email to ask which pistol radios were used with this controller...

Tried the spring trick on the throttle trigger too - didn't work either :(

Might end up just grabbing a 4ch stick radio - wanna get into planes later some stage anyways -lol- But might use the 4ch sticks for the mean time - and save for another controller that will work easily - i dunno yet... might even grab/test the radio that Mr Constructor uses on his over there...

will update when i get some more :) feel free to throw some more input - i'm so desperate! -lol-

MAJOR BREAKTHROUGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Got the TX running with the ESC!!!!!!!!!!!!!! But screwed my brake servo in between -lol-

It was working opposite direction to the esc - so it would brake when i throttle on... tried to swap/resolder the 2 pos and neg wires in the servo - and screwed something up in there, cause it aint workin no more!!! -rotf-!! I'll grab another sevro and have someone that knows what they're doing play with it -lol-


It was a bit of a mix of the exponential and throttle trim settings i think - had to play a bit with subtrim on throttle - and exponential, as it was pretty sensitive around neutral throttle - so i think that was my problem -lol-

I havent run it yet cept in my room (bout 5 meters or so -lol-), as i'm having that problem with the brake servo - it is applying brakes when i throttle on... tried to resolder the pos and neg wires inside the servo - but i think i screwed it, because it's not moving anymore -lmao-!!! I'll pick up a new servo this weekend, and have someone PROFESSIONAL screw with that.... prolly didn't help my iron is mega huge for the job -lmao- Not to worry - gotta learn someday right? -lol-



Another thing i noticed, was that when i went to brake (with brake servo disconnected) it would actually apply more throttle to the motor??? Is this something to do with the "Airplane" and "Basic" mode settings? or something else?

I still havent got into the PC programming - do i need the BEC to be connected with a y-harness aswell as the esc input to the USBCOM when programming with PC? The PC program doesn't seem to respond to the controller when it is turned on (batts connected) after i connect it....

I open "Controller" program ---> Plug in USBCOM---> Connect ESC to USBCOM---> Plug in batts---> No response? Does the BEC need to be connected aswell somewhere possibly?

But this is good - i'm getting closer and have had a major breakthrough with this tx! -lol-

[RC-Monster Mike]

The easy way to fix your brake servo is to turn the linkage around(attach brake linkage to the other side of the servo horn). no need to mess with the wiring and stuff!
Make sure you have any channel mixing disabled, too.
I tried to use an MGM plane controller in a car once...it was not good at all! I didn't have mechanical brakes or anything, but it certainly is not ideal software for land vehicles.

hmmm - i dont really know what ya mean -lol-i get ya - but not really -lol-

Here's a shot of the linkages and servo..... I almost thought you meant to have the arm of the brake mechanism turned around 180 degrees - so it's facing the left instead of right... but that isn't possible really.... - i marked the pic in red of what i thought you were meaning...

mann - i'm making no sense - maybe the pic will -lol-

I think i might have to resolder the motor wires in the servo? I'm not quite sure what you meant by 'turn the linkage around'...

Original, clearer image....
http://www.ausrc.com/galleries/danhf...ST/BLST_43.jpg

And another shot from the side just in case.... if ya want another view LMK :)

[RC-Monster Mike]

I see. In this case, you need to turn the servo over before switching the lkinkage(I was assuming a dual output servo arm). If you turn the servo over, it effectively will reverse it(physically reverse the servo instead of electronically reversing it). Still no need to re solder the servo.
LMK if you are picking up what I am putting down. :)

I had thought about turning it over - but then would have to move the mounts around, as i'm not sure if there's enough room to do it like that.....

But - i've just been told about a "Servo Reverse Lead" that alot of the plane guys use? It's supposed to be pretty small, and sounds like it'd save alot of hassles, so i'm looking into that at the moment :)

Cheers for your help!

[RC-Monster Mike]

Why would you have to move the mounts? It looks like it would fit right in in the pictures. Maybe would need to make a slight linkage adjustment, but it should optherwise work just fine.

hmmm - if i flip the servo on the other side (in the last pic) so that the arm is on the right side, instead of the left... won't the servo still be spining the same direction?

Unless you mean to flip the servo round so the arm is FACING the camera? (in the last pic)

[RC-Monster Mike]

Nope. Just flip it so the arm is on the other side. It will be like reversing the servo when you re-attach the arm.

[MetalMan]

Mike, I don't see your logic. I even went as far as drawing it on a piece of paper, and the rotation didn't reverse when I turned the paper 180 deg.