60C really?

[zeropointbug]

Originally Posted by lutach

I will when the time comes. I am though trying my best to get 2 smaller cells and it's tough. I should just claim I do military work and see if I can get some.

Edit: I did actually let 2 members here see the datasheet.

It's true, I am one of those members, the cells he speaks of are something else. However, I believe Lipo cells are better suited because of significantly higher energy density, and we are getting to the point with these new packs (G3's, TP 40C, etc...) that the packs are not the limiting factor anymore, or at least getting close to what we can physically use. However, that said, it DOES NOT hurt, in fact I encourage it, to have higher C ratings (as most of you would agree) for the mere fact that the battery will run cooler, last longer, and increase system efficiency as a whole.

[lutach]

Originally Posted by zeropointbug

It's true, I am one of those members, the cells he speaks of are something else. However, I believe Lipo cells are better suited because of significantly higher energy density, and we are getting to the point with these new packs (G3's, TP 40C, etc...) that the packs are not the limiting factor anymore, or at least getting close to what we can physically use. However, that said, it DOES NOT hurt, in fact I encourage it, to have higher C ratings (as most of you would agree) for the mere fact that the battery will run cooler, last longer, and increase system efficiency as a whole.

There are new technologies coming soon that will be amazing. I know for a fact that the RC industry was one of the first to adapt to the lithium and a lot of the lithium battery manufacturers out there knows this. I've seen lab results that will only make our hobby safer and at the same time provide lithium cells with amazing power capabilities. I for one am patiently waiting and will try my best to get some of the cells to test them.

[What's_nitro?]

Originally Posted by lutach

There are new technologies coming soon that will be amazing. ...

Remember the video of that fuel-cell powered 1/10 TC?

[pasan]

I'm a n00b, having gotten into the hobby in April of last year. When I was researching LiPos, the first manufacturer I came across was MA. I was smitten by the vivid claims (the 8000mAh VXL packages had just been released, and I was considering a Rustler VXL), and for a while thought they were the shiznit. I could find very little information about anything else, and it just became a hassle digging for info about other packs. The points suicideneil, nitrostarter and others made about n00bs is quite valid and indeed applies to the majority, now more than ever considering how many brushless RTRs are in the market now. Flashy ads appeal to the consumerist mentality in all of us, and more so in the layperson who maybe looking for information in a new and unknown product. So it's only logical that MA probably has garnered the most exposure through their extensive (and I have to admit quite appealing) ad campaigns, and its small wonder that they were voted best by RCCA readers.

Further, being of a consumerist mentality results in quite a bit of scepticism towards any other similar competing product they're exposed to unless they have the "magic" factor in them (in MA's case their 60C rating). If the only difference is price and anecdotal evidence (the latter would often have to be dug up from public forums and/or 3rd part product reviews), a cheaper product would equate to a lower quality product (it's the same battery but cheaper, they must be cutting corners/QC is done by chimps/etc) and a more expensive product with inflated prices and greed (it's a frickin battery, all it does is provide power for my toys). This applies to RC just as much as it would to any other consumer product, and the reality is that RC is way more accessible to the casual user than it was 10 years ago, which has created plenty of casual users with money to spend, who want a novel remote controlled toy that goes 50mph and does standing backflips.

So my point is, partial knowledge is much more damagin in the long run that not knowing at all, and I sincerely hope the whole C rating issue is sorted out before someone gets hurt through the misinterpretation of technical jargon.

[rawfuls]

^Agreed

[TexasSP]

Good post pasan

[suicideneil]

Epic.

There is a dire lack of review sites for the RC hobby; when I was researching my Digital camera choice, I was quickly able to find several online review sites listing every major model released by all the different known (and unknown) companies dating back several years. After a few hours of reading and cross referencing, I arrived at a decision based on helpful and honest reviews, with indepth testing and no favouritism towards any particular brand- you could also see user reviews along with the experts own opinion to see if they all had the same view.

With R/C, you have to rely on magazine adverts and sketchy reviews that are based on personal bias (remember the nitro vs electric revo conversion? the nitro won because the testers felt that the BL revo had too much power; clearly they knew nothing of proper setup or driving technique for the two different platforms) and gut feelings without any proper consistant or meaningful testing (lipo shoot out carried out with vastly differing lipo packs for example).

The best place to go for reviews are forums at present, which is good, but it still isnt the same as a dedicated review center with a well laid out data base of results based on consistant testing (use an appropriate vehicle and motor for each class of lipo (voltage/mah/C rating), based on bench testing with a CBA load tester, and an indoor track that can recreate the same loads and current spikes of normal running- real world results along with bench testing).

[whitrzac]

Originally Posted by suicideneil

Epic.

There is a dire lack of review sites for the RC hobby; when I was researching my Digital camera choice, I was quickly able to find several online review sites listing every major model released by all the different known (and unknown) companies dating back several years. After a few hours of reading and cross referencing, I arrived at a decision based on helpful and honest reviews, with indepth testing and no favouritism towards any particular brand- you could also see user reviews along with the experts own opinion to see if they all had the same view.

With R/C, you have to rely on magazine adverts and sketchy reviews that are based on personal bias (remember the nitro vs electric revo conversion? the nitro won because the testers felt that the BL revo had too much power; clearly they knew nothing of proper setup or driving technique for the two different platforms) and gut feelings without any proper consistant or meaningful testing (lipo shoot out carried out with vastly differing lipo packs for example).

The best place to go for reviews are forums at present, which is good, but it still isnt the same as a dedicated review center with a well laid out data base of results based on consistant testing (use an appropriate vehicle and motor for each class of lipo (voltage/mah/C rating), based on bench testing with a CBA load tester, and an indoor track that can recreate the same loads and current spikes of normal running- real world results along with bench testing).

how many people buy camaras every year?? how many people buy rc stuff??


we can all dream

[suicideneil]

If it makes you feel better, it only cost ~£229 / $366...

[_paralyzed_]

Originally Posted by What's_nitro?

Remember the video of that fuel-cell powered 1/10 TC?

you mean this one

http://cgi.ebay.com/Rare-1-10-TAMIYA...d=p3286.c0.m14

[Mentat]

to settle this once and for all we should DONATE some packs and have them tested by someone here on RCM. I would be willing to donate a Thunder Power 5000mAh 4s1p 40c for testing purposes, provided i got it back once testing is completed. There are several here that i would trust to do this. Thoughts, suggestions? Lets do this and get some REAL WORLD feedback on these CLAIMS!

[What's_nitro?]

Originally Posted by _paralyzed_

you mean this one

http://cgi.ebay.com/Rare-1-10-TAMIYA...d=p3286.c0.m14

Yeah, that's the one.

[hoober]

Originally Posted by Mentat

to settle this once and for all we should DONATE some packs and have them tested by someone here on RCM. I would be willing to donate a Thunder Power 5000mAh 4s1p 40c for testing purposes, provided i got it back once testing is completed. There are several here that i would trust to do this. Thoughts, suggestions? Lets do this and get some REAL WORLD feedback on these CLAIMS!

Why don't we try to throw something together in the off season? We can start with the maxamps pack. Is the goal here to check a pack's abiblity to deliver what it's ratings say it will? Or to put like packs in order of performance?

In any case I would like to test packs that are a "standard" size and as much capacity as possible , but limit to 2S. The standard size is what a 6 cell stick pack is and the standard 6 cell 1/18 scale packs as well.

Have I missed anyone?

dezfan $20
Unsullied_Spy $5
nitrostarter
lincpimp
FastXR
Bondonutz $20
rawfuls
FastXR $10
hoober $20

[Mentat]

Sure, i think it would be a great ideal, maybe we can get RC Monster (Mike) to do something official and get some of the companies to join in somehow. Rc Monster is big anyway, i think with a little help maybe we can get some standardized testing, or at least make this THE PLACE that people go to get the scoop on Real World Lipo Testing and reviews. Mike what do you think?

[BrianG]

I personally think Mike has enough on his plate. The last time I talked to him, he said he started growing another set of arms to keep up with the workload.

As far as what should be tested; I think the ratings should be substantiated at the very least. And provide the voltage per cell at that rating along with the temperature.