going to buy a rifle---advice?

[Riko]

Originally Posted by JThiessen

I think the jury is definitely still out on this one....we may be applying to your gov't for financial aid in the next few years.

come again?...how come?

I must say to him, respect + a job very very well done in having the courage to actually implement health care for every single US citizen!
Health care is for the general public and so it is only normal that the general public finances that kind of system.

So I welcome you to the club of countries with a public health care system, at last ;)

[lincpimp]

Originally Posted by JThiessen

I think the jury is definitely still out on this one....we may be applying to your gov't for financial aid in the next few years.

I'd agree with Linc's IQ statement. Getting a "piece" is a status symbol among some of our minority communities.

I have a feeling the jury will never be "in"...

And yes, having a "gat" is a status symbol, especially to the various scum...

Originally Posted by Riko

come again?...how come?

I must say to him, respect + a job very very well done in having the courage to actually implement health care for every single US citizen!
Health care is for the general public and so it is only normal that the general public finances that kind of system.

So I welcome you to the club of countries with a public health care system, at last ;)

What you say is very true, however the US lacks the needed laws to keep this sort of thing fair to the people paying in (ie me). Too many people on welfare, illegal immigrants and also too many people who do not take care of themselves (smokers, fat bastards, drug addicts, etc). Not sure if i am interested paying for health care for people that I do not think are worth the air they breathe. I am a small business owner and the burden of paying for all of this crap falls on me and my peers. The health care system does need reform, but the proposed health care system does not benefit people like me, yet I am expected to cough up for it. Not really fair.

I can only imagine that you do not have the quantity of free loading scum in your country that we do... Maybe I should move there! But it sounds like I would have to finance the move by selling my gun collection... Catch 22 there!

[Riko]

Originally Posted by lincpimp

I have a feeling the jury will never be "in"...

And yes, having a "gat" is a status symbol, especially to the various scum...



What you say is very true, however the US lacks the needed laws to keep this sort of thing fair to the people paying in (ie me). Too many people on welfare, illegal immigrants and also too many people who do not take care of themselves (smokers, fat bastards, drug addicts, etc). Not sure if i am interested paying for health care for people that I do not think are worth the air they breathe. I am a small business owner and the burden of paying for all of this crap falls on me and my peers. The health care system does need reform, but the proposed health care system does not benefit people like me, yet I am expected to cough up for it. Not really fair.

I can only imagine that you do not have the quantity of free loading scum in your country that we do... Maybe I should move there! But it sounds like I would have to finance the move by selling my gun collection... Catch 22 there!

I must admit that what you say is also true, also here in Europe we are oposed to people who are abusing 'the system', of course.
Escpecially when I am talking about our unemployment benefit system. But talking about health care, everybody (in our eyes) has the right to be threated in a hospital and have medical help with the least expense.
In our system you do not even have to be national resident, every foreigner can just go or walk into a hospital and have the best medical care at no cost, if that person is in need of medical health care.
No papers no nothing.

We have our principles and for us Social Welfare is crucial in society, a society and system build on 1 think solidarity.
In fact social welfare is almost holy (and public health care is the most important elements of that social welfare).

We have put all cons and pro next to each other and in the end, the whole community is better of with a system that is build on "solidarity"
Its not like the government just decided one day to have such a system, no, the whole system (pension, unemplyoment, health, etc) came from private initiative begin 20th century late 19th century. And it has grown, and since the world wars our goverments have realized that they had to end all this injustice on these many areas, so they began to take initiatives and in time it all went government controlled organisations.
So another example of something that has grown historically and still works on till today.

Let me also say that there are very small majorities in european states that would like to build down the system (not completely, tha tis not accepted here), but let's say, these people are not so popular. Mostely ultra libiral parties (you could compare them with the Republican party)

I can imagine however that in a society like in the States where it is and always has been "each and everyone for his own", more individual minded (some would call it more selfish) it is hard to accept principles like solidarity.
But what I find worring in the States is that the so called Healt Care organisation and companies that should be involved with the health and wellbeing of the people, that they are only after money and profit and that Healthcare is subsidiary...It is no secret that the insurance companies in the States are/were based on profit, wich is criminal in the eyes of people who live in a social social welfare state...

Can you accept the fact that you have to pay a bunch of money for a small but needed operation, medicine etc etc etc.
In the English system for example you only pay 1 pond for any medicine you need, no matter what it is, if you have a proscription from the docter and you need a certain medicin or whatever you just pay 1 pound, no matter the product you need, no matter what your disease. That is because we think our health is so vital that no expense should be taken to secure our health...and that kind of thinking can only be subsidiated by a system were EVERYBODY makes a small contribution.
The idea of paying a lot of money for medicine, how small or big they may be, is just absurd in our eyes.


So you see, not all things controlled by the goverment have to be evil or communist, that is the misperception too many Americans have about a Welfare system, just look at Europe, are we communists? are we that poor? I didn't think so :)
And Obama knows this and wants to change things, wants to end that kind of injustice, but somehow, there are (pretty plenty) americans who think that any kind of social program or goverment regulation is a form of communism for god sake!
It is not only a change of system, but for many Americans a change of minds and opinions. That is his hardest task as president I think...changing a way of living that has been going on since the late 18th century.

Personally, I think health care is the best idea and system modern society has every invented!
And believe me if I tell you, Obama ain't no communist nor are his ideas ;)



ps: there are also political parties (the far right, some extremists some not so) that are making a program out of people (mostly foreigners, being muslims in the first place) who profit from our social welfare state (unemployment benefit, etc etc)
True for some of those people, but certainly not all of them.
So, also here we have issues :)